Transcending Identities … with Hayden Moon

ID  00:00

Access Granted is a production for Powerd Media. 

Emma

Welcome to Access Granted - a podcast for anyone seeking inclusion when it comes to living with disability. I'm Emma Myers, and in this episode, I hear from someone who's made an active change to the gender qualification standards within the Irish dance community.

Hayden 00:34

I had to work with some pro bono lawyers to change the official Australian Irish dancing policy to be able to compete because the policy didn't allow me to compete in the men's section. Hayden

Emma 00:46

Moon is a dancer, writer and passionate advocate for LGBTQIA First Nations and disability issues. Here he shares his experience as a trans man living with disability, and how an incident within a dance company sparked a passion for advocacy and inclusion, access granted is where the personal and the Political collide. It's curious conversations between people living with disability, hearing about advocacy, the push for change, and discussing ideas for a more accessible world. You're listening to access granted with Emma Myers, I don't want it to be too serious. Say hey Lin, I want to start by asking you for a funny story about you as a kid. When I

Hayden 01:45

was, I think seven or eight, my family went on a trip to, I think it was Port Douglas, but it was like one of those, like holiday like, beach, beachy places. And I thought it would be a genius idea to bury my glasses in the sand at the beach and then try and dig them up and find them, except that I never found them. And we got my whole family digging in the beach, and no one could ever find them. And My glasses are very like, specially made because of how severe my vision is so they're like, over $1,000 pair of glasses that I just, you know, decided to bury in the sand at the beach, and we never found them. So the rest of the holiday, I was even more blind than I normally am, and when we got home, my family had to pay for a new, expensive pair of designer, not designer, but like, you know, specifically made glasses for me, just because I thought it would be a great idea to do that.

Emma 02:43

I love that so much. Um, so can you tell me a bit about what it was like growing up with all of these different identities?

Hayden 02:57

Yeah, good question. So I would say, growing up as a trans person, I guess it's hard to answer because we didn't have the language back then. You know, I was telling my family like, I'm a boy, I'm a boy, when I was about three years old, and I thought I was just like all the other boys. Always played with all the other boys, the kids all thought I was a boy. But I just get kept getting told like, no, no, you're confused. You know, you're you're confused, Sweetie, you're a girl. So it was just a very confusing time for me, and in that sense, and became even more confusing when I started to go through puberty, because then all of a sudden, I wasn't allowed to do all the boy kind of things I was doing as a kid, because I was told that I had to, you know, be a girl now and be a woman now. 

And that was a really confusing time, especially as my body was changing and changing in ways that I wasn't expecting it to, because that's not how I viewed myself and how I felt inside. So it was confusing and complicated in that sense, but like I said, we didn't have the language, so I didn't know why I felt the way I did, and why I was so different. I didn't really realize what being trans meant until I was in uni, and that's when I realised that there was a label for my experiences. But in terms of like growing up with disability, it's complex. 

So I was diagnosed as autistic when I was seven, but my family never told me, so I basically, kind of have a very similar, similar experience to autistic people who were diagnosed later in life, except that I wasn't like I was diagnosed as a kid, but my family thought that it would be best not to tell me, and they did it with my best interests at heart. But you know, I like to say they were misguided. You know, they they made a decision that they thought was the the best decision to make. But I... don't believe it was. 

And when I've asked members of my family who I'm close with, like my grandma, for example, she said that she didn't want me to feel like I was different to the other kids, and she didn't want me to feel alone and to get bullied. And I just said to her, But I already was different to the other kids, and I was already getting bullied and I already felt alone. At least, if you'd told me why, then I could have understood, but I just knew that I was different. So that was hard, I guess, growing up as an autistic kid, but not knowing that I was autistic and knowing that I was different, knowing that I struggled to like interact with the other kids, knowing that I saw the world differently, that I interacted differently to the other kids, but not knowing why, and in terms of my vision as well, I did get bullied quite a lot for having very thick glasses and for not being able to see. 

And I never used my cane when I was a kid because I already felt different enough, and I didn't want to make it worse. And things like swimming carnivals and stuff like that, like I'd have to take my glasses off, and then I couldn't see a thing, and then teachers would have to guide me back. And I just felt really othered, because everyone was kind of staring at me, not that I could see them staring, but like I knew that they were. Yeah, yeah, I don't know. I just, I guess I just felt really alone, and there was nobody else that I could relate to, and I did get a lot of comments and a lot of staring and a lot of questions about why I was different, and that was really hard.

Emma 06:33

And what is the primary identity that you advocate for?

Hayden 06:40

I mainly advocate for the trans community, but I do advocate for the LGBTQIA community in general, and the First Nations community and the disabled community, but, yeah, most of my advocacy has been for the trans community.

Emma 06:56

And what's been the response from the First Nations community in relation to your transition?

Hayden 07:06

It's been really great. I think the reason why, I mean, I can't speak for every Aboriginal community, because there are many, like multiple mobs, but I think the reason why there isn't a word specifically for disability is just because our community doesn't really see people as different, and the Aboriginal community has always been incredibly inclusive of trans people, of people with different sexualities and people with disabilities, like it's you don't have these labels in those communities. 

So it's not a negative thing that they there aren't those those terms. It's more like, Well, why would we separate people who are different? Why? Why would we do that? So it's a positive thing. We're such a tight knit community that it doesn't really cross the minds of elders and of members of our community to separate people out into labels, because we're just all one community that support each other. 

Emma 08:06

Growing up with a person who caught your imagination and made you believe that you could be who you wanted to be.

Hayden 08:17

Absolutely. So my Grandma Moon, who I love very, very much, she was my best friend. She unfortunately passed away earlier this year, but yeah, she was my best friend. We were so close, very similar people, both Cancerians. So if you're into astrology, yeah, she was my number one fan, and just yeah, all through my life, she celebrated every achievement I did, like, I'm currently clearing out her house, and, my God, it's full of, like, drawings I did when I was five years old, like the most ridiculous things, like scribbles that she's kept for like, over 20 years. She was so proud of me regardless of what I did. 

And I shared this story with a friend recently. When I was seven years old, I decided that I wanted to get a PhD. And my friend said, what? Seven year old wants a PhD? And I was like, an autistic one. And so I told my grandma that I wanted to get a PhD, and she was like, Well, if you want to do that, you can do that. And she was the first person who'd ever said that to me, because all in school, all the teachers and stuff, are always telling my parents that, like, you know, because I struggled to concentrate, and I struggled with social skills that I wouldn't I wouldn't make it to uni, and I wouldn't do very well, and we'd have to look at other things. And my grandma was like, if you want to do that, you can do that. 

And the same with dancing, you know, she, she got me into Irish dancing. And a lot of people, when I was doing dancing or sports, were like, you know, because of your vision, we don't think you're going to be very good at this, or maybe you should try something else. And she was like, no, if you want to do it, you should do it. And I think if I didn't have her, I wouldn't have the strive that I had. And I certainly wouldn't be where I am today without her. So, yeah, big, big, thank you to my grandma.

Emma 10:07

I think everyone's got their favorite grandparent.

Hayden 10:11

Yeah, definitely. 

Emma 10:14

And in your quest to become your true self, what were some of the hurdles that you had to face - can you describe some of the challenges?

Hayden 10:24

Yeah, so quite a lot, actually. My parents aren't supportive. We don't talk. I came out to some close friends at the end of 2017 and then at the beginning of 2018 I started to come out more publicly. So I came out to my dance teacher at the the dance school I was at at the time, and I'd been there for like, four years. They were like a second family to me. We were really good friends. We were very close. And she said that if I wanted to remain at the school, I had to dance as a woman, and I had to use my birth name, because she didn't want the children to be exposed to "gender confusion". That's a direct quote. And so basically, I was like, Well, I can't do that. 

So I was asked to leave the school, and I had to find another school that would accept me. Thankfully, I did. And then while I was there, I had to work with some pro bono lawyers to change the official Australian Irish dancing policy to be able to compete, because the policy didn't allow me to compete in the men's section. They were like, No, you were born a girl, therefore you have to dance as a girl. And I was like, That goes against the law. So yeah, we just presented them with a bunch of information, and basically the 2013 Anti Discrimination Act, the amendment to the sex and gender Anti Discrimination Act, and we just said Your policy needs to improve. And we were able to change that, thankfully, because anyone who's a dancer will know that your dance school does become like a family. 

And for me, they were like they were my family, and yet to lose them just for being who I am, was devastating. It was kind of just like, Oh, okay, these people who said they love me, don't actually love the real me. So I lost, yeah, I lost pretty much all of my friends and chosen family. A few people stuck around, but not many, and I basically had to rebuild my life from there. But thankfully, I'm now surrounded by incredible communities with a beautiful dance teacher who recently danced at my gender affirmation celebration a few weeks ago. 

And if you told me, like back in 2018 that I would have an Irish dance teacher who not only accepts me, but performed with me at my gender affirmation celebration. I wouldn't have believed you, so it was a really rough time, but yeah, I've come through it, and I have so many beautiful communities full of people who love me, for me, and I'm very grateful

Emma 12:58

You're listening to access granted with Emma Myers. While I was doing my research, I came across an instance where you'd said that you'd been... to an optometrist, and they asked you about your status as a transgender person. 

Hayden 13:21

Yeah, there's a term for it, the trans broken arm syndrome, which is basically like, you know, a trans person goes to a doctor or a medical professional, for example, a broken arm, and you just get asked about, like, your, you know, your body and your genitals. And unfortunately, it does happen quite a lot. So yeah. I mean, I went to, yeah, I went to an ophthalmologist. And at first, because I was quite much earlier in my transition, yeah, at first she called me, she and I just said, Oh, it's he, and she... kind of stared at me, and she didn't really know what to say. And so then I was like, Oh well, I'm transgender. And she went, Oh, okay, right. And then she went, have you had a sex change? And I just kind of froze, because yeah, I'm like, I'm here for my eyes. What does my, what do my genitals have to do with that? It's not the only time that something like that's happened. 

I had a psychiatrist who I went to for ADHD medication who asked me if, like, and more explicitly, asked me about my genitals. I won't repeat the words that were used, but was, yeah, it was very much like, do you have this set of genitals? And I was like, pretty sure we're here to talk about ADHD, which has nothing to do with my genitals. And I did. I did actually call her out on it. And I said, you know, Why do you need to know that? And she said, Oh, well, I need to know if you're on any like, what hormone replacement therapy you're on, because it could interact with some of the medication that I give you. 

And I was like, Okay, well, then you ask that question. You don't ask about my genitals, because the question, the answer that you need, isn't the question that you asked. So you could ask, are you on testosterone? Or what hormones are you on? And I would happily give you that answer, but you asked me about my genitals, which isn't related to that at all. So yeah, unfortunately, it does happen a lot, and far worse things as well. And it's just tiring and it's frustrating and it's unnecessary. 

Emma 15:41

And as an advocate for the trans community, why so committed to to do what you do, what drives you forward? 

Hayden 15:51

I just want a better future for my community. It's hard work, and a lot of the situations I've been through as a trans advocate like, especially the one with the Irish dance community and advocating in terms of medical spaces and stuff like that. Like, it's been a hard run. Like, it's been hard, but at least I'm kind of like, well, if I go through it, then that means that other trans people don't have to go through it. You know, for example, if I could change the policy in Irish dance, then no other trans person has to go through what I went through, and it was a really awful experience that I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy. I just want to create a world that is equal for us, that's easier for us to live in. As heavy as it sounds, I want my community to stay alive. 

There's a lot of negativity towards our community, and people are dying, and I want to stop that. And anything I can do to keep my community alive, to keep my community thriving, and to make our lives easier and happier, I'm going to do.

Emma 16:51

And in terms of advocating for those living with disability, when you are performing Irish dance or dance in general... do you want the audience to know you're legally blind, or is it more about dance or the intersection of the two?

Hayden 17:11

I don't know. I guess I dance because I love it, and I guess I do think about my disability when I'm dancing, but more in the sense of I want to prove to people that you can still be a dancer if you're legally blind. Yes, it's going to be harder and they're going to be different accommodations that you're going to need, but you can absolutely do it. And it just comes down to having supportive dance teachers in all of the styles of dance I do. I've got really supportive dance teachers who will come up to me in my line of vision and show me what the steps are, and allow me to be at the front of the class, and allow me to ask questions about specific things, and we'll describe things auditory, audio-ly. Is that a word? 

Emma 17:54

It can be, if you want, that's not a word. Is it ordered? Ordered? I can't even say and I've got the speech impediments.

Hayden 18:07

They will describe things verbally. There we go. That's better. They'll describe things verbally for me. And, yeah, like they make dancing more accessible for me. And I guess, yeah, I guess I do think about it, but I think about it more in the sense of, I'm showing people that your disability doesn't have to hold you back from doing what you want to do, if you want to be a dancer, if you want to be on stage, if you want to perform, if you want to do anything. I mean, I'm not into soccer, but if you want to do if you want to play soccer and you're legally blind, that doesn't have to hold you back. 

So yeah, I guess I do think about it in that sense, and it's a really good feeling. At my celebration recently, I actually overheard a friend of mine who I dance with say to her friend, oh my God, every time I watch Hayden dance, I'm like, Isn't he supposed to be legally blind? That's not fair.

Emma 19:03

Those are the best kind of comments.

Hayden 19:05

That's it, right? And I just giggled, like, that's the kind of response that I want people to have, you know, to be like, yeah, actually, being legally blind hasn't held me back, and therefore it won't hold you back either.

Emma 19:19

So fee, it's dance a real moment of liberation and expression. 

Hayden 19:25

Absolutely, yeah, definitely. Dance is an outlet. Dance makes me feel free. It takes me out of reality for a bit. You know, it's like, I don't have to think about the world being hard for someone like me to live in, and I don't have to think about whatever I'm going through. I just leave it at the door, and then I go into the studio, and I can just be free as I dance to the music in whichever style. And I just love it. 

Emma 19:55

You were chosen as the one of the Australian Ambassador dance fit in International Day of People with Disability - describe your feelings when you found that out.

Hayden 20:07

I mean, I was just really honoured. Yeah, I was really honored. I called up one of my best friends, and when I told her, I've just been asked to be an ambassador, and she was like, Oh my God. Like, that's incredible. And I was like, Yeah, I still kind of didn't believe it. I don't know, I guess I, I was kind of just like, Oh, like, they knew, they know who I am, and they think that I'm, like, of that caliber. Like, that's incredible. And, you know, I kind of looked at who the past ambassadors had been, and, yeah, there were some big names up there. And I was like, oh gosh, I don't know if I can. I don't know level up to those people. I don't know if I'm like, have they I did the kind of like, imposter syndrome thing, of like, have they made a mistake? Did they contact the wrong person? 

Like, yeah, it was... a really awesome feeling. And then I was just like, Oh my God, I want to tell everyone that...  I can't... and that was really hard, because I was like, so proud, but obviously, like, I couldn't announce it yet, and I was just like, Oh my God, I want to tell everyone. Yeah, it was... an incredible feeling. And when I could finally tell people, I was like, shouting it from the rooftops.

Emma 21:14

What did, what does it mean to you to be an... 

Hayden 21:22

So yeah, it means a lot like, I mean, for me personally, it's good to see specifically trans representation in the ambassadors, to be able to bring that voice to these discussions is something I'm really, really happy to do. And, yeah, I think just to be able to share my experience as someone with multiple identities and multiple disabilities this year with quite a diverse group of people. I yeah, I just, I think it's really important, and I hope that, for example, like young queer and trans disabled kids can see themselves represented. 

And you know, can... think things like, Oh, well, I can make it to university if I want to. I can do a PhD if I want to. I can dance if I want to and not have my disability hold me back. I can transition if I want to and not have my disability hold me back. You know, I hope to be that for other people in my community.

Emma 22:21

And last question, what does access granted look like to you?

Hayden 22:28

It means inclusion in, you know, to summarise it all up, but to expand on that, I think, yeah, I very much subscribe to, like, the social model of disability in the sense that I think that the world is disabling to us in the way that it's been designed. And so I think access granted is, yeah, people making an effort to include us in the conversation, to include us in events, to allow us to even enter the building sometimes, and I think that's really important for disabled people to have full, enriched lives, you know, because we can't live our best lives if we're not even able to walk through the front door. So I think for me, it means, yeah, it means inclusion. 

Emma 23:24

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