Speaker 1 00:02
This is a Vision Australia radio podcast.
Speaker 2 00:18
On Vision Australia Radio, welcome to our conversations on the work and experiences of emerging writers. I'm Kate Cooper, and this week I'm delighted to introduce to you again my colleague Matthew Erdely, who was a guest on this programme in April. In 2023, Matthew produced and presented a series of podcasts titled Artists Unearthed. In episode 2, Matthew spoke with Joanne Hartstone, theatre maker, performer and producer, who Matthew describes as a tour de force in Adelaide's theatre scene, who has had shows featured on Broadway and around the world.
Matthew spoke with Joanne during the 2023 Adelaide Fringe Festival, and both have given us their kind permission to reproduce their conversation in this programme. Here is Matthew Erdely in conversation with Joanne Hartstone.
Speaker 3 01:17
My name's Matthew Erdely, with me today is Joanne Hartstone. Thank you for being here today, Joanne Hartstone. And just straight up, if I am lost for words at any point during this podcast, it's literally because I am in awe of what you do and what you bring to the Adelaide arts sector and beyond. So if I get tongue-tied, this is not just a convenient way for me to cover up any goofs, but no, or if I'm not looking at you directly, it's like, Oh my God, I can't believe Joanne Hartstone actually said yes to this. So thank you for being here.
Speaker 4 01:55
I don't know, it's wonderful.
Speaker 3 01:56
Everyone, this is how the podcast is going to work. I'm going to ask a question. Joanne has a 12 sided dice. Please roll the dice.
Speaker 4 02:06
Is this for the first question? Oh no, this is just so people can prove that I have a dice. Everybody listening?
Speaker 3 02:13
That is the sound of a dice. It's authentic. It's not some sound effect. So I will ask a question, Joanne will roll the dice. That's how many words she initially has to answer the question. Then we'll do a bit of back and forth follow up.
Speaker 3 02:27
And we have a few questions and yeah, it'll be it.
Speaker 4 02:31
And to clarify, I have up to that number, not I have to use all of the words. Suddenly I'll just be adding random words onto my answer just to make it work.
Speaker 3 02:44
All right, so your first question is, can you please tell us simply about what you do?
Speaker 4 02:51
Four.
Speaker 3 02:52
Good luck.
Speaker 4 02:53
Theatre cabaret art live. Perfect. There you go. There's four words that...
Speaker 3 03:03
That's perfect. I honestly don't think there is any need for follow-up. Let's just move to the next question then.
Speaker 4 03:09
Well, let me... I don't know if your listeners had a little interruption in there, but I should mention that there is another person in the room whilst we have this podcast. I had a baby four months ago. So we have an extra little human in the room. So if you hear any crying or whinging... right on cue darling, there you go... it's not Matthew. It's actually my child. So we better be entertaining because otherwise we'll definitely know about it.
Speaker 3 03:39
Let's get into a bit more about what you do.
Speaker 4 03:42
So I said, theatre, cabaret, art, live. That was my answer. So that's, yeah, that's it in a nutshell. I perform, I... Someone actually told me an interesting thing about what I do, which is, I make things happen. And I feel that that's actually a good description of what I do. I do make things happen. Mostly they're in the performing arts realm of making things happen. Yeah, I guess if you think about all of the various areas of performing arts, where you've got, you've got shows, of course, you've got festivals, you've got venues, you've got new creations, you've got international touring. I, yeah, I do all of that and make things happen. So I guess I'm most known for my work in fringe, but not just. And I also teach on top of all of that, I teach this craft.
Speaker 3 04:38
Talk about making things happen, like the first connection that we had was of the Suffrage Soapbox.
Speaker 4 04:45
Oh yeah, that's right.
Speaker 3 04:47
And that was such a cool interactive experience, for want of better words, out the front of the...
Speaker 4 04:56
Centre of Democracy. That's right. Yeah, on North Terrace in Adelaide. That's right.
Speaker 3 05:03
Completely open to the public, walking back and forth. And it was just a topic that I hadn't really sort of known too much about. And I was just, it was so cool to be involved. So yeah, absolutely. And you make things happen and people take notice. People literally stop what they're doing to come to these shows and experiences. So yeah, amazing to have you here. The next question is, get that dice ready, but what's the earliest memory that you have of the arts and what inspired you to take them seriously and actually make something happen? Six. Not bad, not bad.
Speaker 4 05:41
Dance class, age four, my teacher.
Speaker 3 05:44
I did consider because it was a two-part question, allowing you to roll the dice a second time, but then I thought, No, you're nailing it, you're doing really well. There was no like, no pauses of any kind, a little bit of a pause. Dance class. Yes. Tell us more about that.
Speaker 4 06:04
So when I was a very little girl, I wanted to be a ballerina. I think probably because they're the sort of dolls that little girls get given, and that's the sort of the books that you read. There was, I think, a mouse ballerina that I used to read, Angelina Ballerina, and I was always putting on costumes and doing little performances for my parents, my parents' friends, and that sort of thing. And I thought I wanted to go to dance class, and so at the age of four, I was nearly five, my parents enrolled me in Debbie Thomas Dance School. But instead of putting me in ballet, they put me in jazz ballet, which I think was a really good thing to do because it didn't mean that I had to have this sort of structured ballet, I mean, it was structured, of course, but it wasn't that kind of fine art ballet, it was more jazz, you know, it was energetic, it was fun, I got to use all of my facial expressions.
And so my first concert was a little dance to the song Do You Love Me Now That I Can Dance. It's best known from Dirty Dancing. And of course, you know, being, I think I was four or five by the time the concert came around, and you know, you see all these gorgeous little girls nervously pointing and doing hip flexors and stuff like that, and there I am with this huge smile on my face, really going for it. But of course, I was quite nervous before I did it. My dad encouraged me, because I told my dad, you know, Daddy, I'm nervous, and he said, Joey, if you weren't nervous, there'd be something wrong with you.
So I did it, and I had a really great time. And I continued doing dancing until the age of about 17, from four till 17. And that was my first steps into performing arts. But through that school, I did acting classes, and then through my, I then changed to Cheryl Bradley Dance Studios. And it was Cheryl Bradley who gave me a pamphlet for NIDA when I was, I think I was about 12. And she said, you're really good. You should look at going here after school, you know, after year 12. And I thought, that's one who saw something in me and encouraged me and told me to do something that I would have thought that being a performer was not a career option for me, for anyone.
I'm always told that you can never make any money, and it's true, you can never make any money. You're always poor. But I didn't think it could be a career until someone that I really respected took it seriously. And turns out I didn't go to NIDA after year 12. I didn't even audition. But what I did do is I auditioned for Flinders Drama School, and I got in straight away.
Speaker 3 09:10
And what a privileged position you are in as a teacher yourself to be in that space where you can potentially be that person that inspires one of your students to be able to take the path that you did. And that's an absolute privilege to be in.
Speaker 4 09:31
It's a big responsibility, I have to say, because, you know, when you're learning, when you're, I mean, we're all the eternal students when... the performing arts, we're always learning, we're always developing our craft. But when you're young and you've got dreams and you've got a teacher that you respect... it is a very delicate balance because when you're... learning the craft, you actually have to be broken down a little bit. You have to wipe your slate clean of mannerisms. You have to really know who you are and kind of come to terms with your, how you get nervous and, and how that, how that is shown in performance. And then you have to receive constructive criticism in order to improve.
So it can be quite a vulnerable space. So my job as a teacher is to gently guide, but also do it effectively, knowing that it's not about the human being, the personality, it's about the work. So hopefully my students would say that, that they've had a really good time working with me and learning from me. And I tend to say that I've become friends afterwards with quite a lot of my students and I've worked with a lot of my students as well. So I think that's a pretty good sign that I haven't destroyed too many souls along the way.
Speaker 3 10:51
So that implies you have destroyed a few souls. Can you tell us about those? Let's go to the next question. Tell us about some of your current projects that you have on the boil.
Speaker 4 11:04
Eleven. Yes. Okay. Okay, eleven. Here we go. Adelaide Fringe. Seven shows. Four venues.
Speaker 3 11:13
Oh, this is tight.
Speaker 4 11:14
Networking, old friends, great work. Samuels.
Speaker 3 11:18
I'm absolutely speechless. It was a delight to behold. Just when I thought I had seen it all in terms of performance sense from you, seeing that was inspiring. Yeah, in previous years, you know, you've been across a lot of spaces, you've been a part of your own venues, particularly like in Adelaide Botanical Gardens, which I was also lucky enough to be a part of making things happen. What does your Adelaide Fringe experience look like this year? And keeping in mind that when this podcast comes out, it will be after the fact, but tell us about more about the shows that you're involved with this year and why you're proud to be involved with them.
Speaker 4 12:04
Yeah, great. It's really interesting, isn't it, that this is like a little slice of time. So I'm about to say something and I could be proven completely wrong and we'll find out afterwards. But as of this moment, I am presenting seven shows in Adelaide Fringe. Like I'm not going to be presenting more shows than seven in Adelaide Fringe. And five of them are currently active. Tomorrow night is the opening night of one of them. And then I think Tuesday night after this, so this is in three days' time, the final one opens. So still launching kind of the first week of Fringe. So do you know, Matthew, this is my 17th Adelaide Fringe.
Speaker 3 12:55
What's, I know, I can't even count that high.
Speaker 4 12:59
Your dice only goes to 12. So yes, 17 years of doing this. I should start taking it seriously next year, I think.
Speaker 3 13:11
Do you get life membership? Is that a thing in the fridge? I mean...
Speaker 4 13:14
No, every year it's dangerous and I have to start again.
Speaker 3 13:20
If you reach like, say, 25, do you get keys to the city?
Speaker 4 13:24
I should get keys to the city actually.
Speaker 3 13:27
I'll see you in eight years and I'll literally present you with a key if you do not receive one from the Adelaide Council. That would be brilliant.
Speaker 4 13:33
Nice. Yeah, that would be really good. So, I'm presenting three shows at Gluttony. One is The Gods, the Gods, the Gods, which is an incredible piece of gig theatre.
Speaker 3 13:46
Can we just, I just want to interject there because I've seen that show and it's phenomenal. It's just phenomenal. It's so inspiring. It's motivational. It's transformative. I remember seeing it was a...
Speaker 4 13:58
I think it was here last, pre-COVID.
Speaker 3 14:01
Yeah, that's right. And I remember being so tired at the time, because yeah, it's a later time slot show. It has to be. It has to be. It lends itself to that. But I think that actually added to the experience.
Speaker 4 14:14
It has to be a nighttime thing. If it's daytime, it doesn't quite work. It's gig theatre. Gig theatre is kind of combining, how do I describe it, like a nightclub with theatre. The whole point of a nightclub, of course, is the night. Some magical things happen in the night, especially when you're communing with the gods and theatre and each other. It's by Wright and Granger, who I've had a long association with, and with a very specialist lighting design by George Court, who's done an incredible job at transforming a tent in Gluttony, the Kingfisher, I think it is, into a nightclub. It's actually touring Australia after this. It's going to the Sydney Opera House after this. It's an amazing show. And we just won a Best Theatre Award for Week 1 Adelaide Fringe.
Speaker 3 15:16
Hell yeah, it's the least that the show deserves. Everyone needs to see it - and no doubt it will be back at the Adelaide Fringe in future years because it's just so incredible, it's so popular.
Speaker 4 15:28
The second show at Gluttony is also by Wright and Granger and it's one that you would know as well, is Orpheus.
Speaker 3 15:35
Look, yeah. Yeah, once again, yeah, I do know that show well. And it's just, to see that out under the stars is just magical. And so the location that it's in the island, I think it's the island.
Speaker 4 15:52
Yeah, so it's in the middle of the lake at Gluttony, so amongst the trees, surrounded by water. It's a show about the Greek legend Orpheus, but it's done really humbly. So if you think the contrast between the gods, which is really like electric and loud and all that sort of stuff, Orpheus is sort of the complete opposite. It's no amplification, one acoustic guitar, one performer with a notebook, and no lights just under the trees, surrounded by water, telling a story, singing some songs. It's the most beautiful piece. So it's the fourth year it's been to Adelaide, and it always, like people just absolutely love it. People keep coming back, people come back multiple times to see it because it's just that sort of amazing, soul-enhancing piece of theatre.
Speaker 3 16:48
Yeah, it says intimate of pace of theatre as you can possibly, possibly get.
Speaker 2 16:57
On Vision Australia Radio, you're listening to Emerging Writers. This week, featuring Matthew Erdely and Joanne Hartstone in conversation on Artists Unearthed.
Speaker 4 17:11
What shall I tell you about the other shows? Like, there are seven and I've done two. I'll go fast.
Speaker 3 17:16
Do you want to roll the dice for each one of them?
Speaker 4 17:19
No, I'll go faster if I just say it. Also at Gluttony there's Horse Country, which is a surreal comedy, and that's by a Welsh theatre company, which is a bit like Waiting for Godot, but modern and funny as anything, and they are absolutely amazing. And that, like, is being hit on the head with a wet fish. That's how surreal it is, you know, it's just brilliant. And then I also have a show at Holden Street called Mustard, and Mustard is an amazing piece of theatre by Eva O 'Connor, which is about love and obsession and insecurities and vulnerabilities, all combined with the hot, tasty smothering of mustard, where she covers herself in hot English mustard as sort of a parallel to Irish-English colonialism, that sort of thing.
It's an amazing piece, and it's just got all these five-star reviews. So that's at Holden Street. Then I have The Marvelous Elephant Man, the musical at the Wonderland Shpiegel Tent. This is big. This is like a really big new musical, original, which I think is going to have a huge life. I think Adelaide is the place where new shows can sort of emerge, but it also gets the right people seeing the work, right? This is going to have a very large trajectory, and I think it's going to be a main stage musical moving forward, an Australian main stage musical. So The Marvelous Elephant Man, obviously, the story of Joseph Merrick, but it's a bit like The Book of Mormon meets Beauty and the Beast, like it's that kind of epic.
It's sassy and funny and sad, and the songs are just glorious. So I know, I've got to be fast, but Marvelous Elephant Man, the musical, is a really huge. Then I've got A Place That Belongs to Monsters at Treasury 1860, which is in the courtyard there. Again, another piece, Under the Stars by Casey J Andrews, which is Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse story, but with women. So it's about what it's like to be an angry woman in society, or four angry women in society, and she's an incredible storyteller, and that hasn't launched yet, but it did really well in the Summer Hall in Edinburgh last year. Then the last one is a digital show, which comes from Hollywood, and it's called Teaching a Robot to Love.
And so this is available to watch from home, so there's no venue. The venue is your lounge room, and you get to watch an original family-friendly musical about the lovely trope, of course, is some young engineers come to a big city, and they want to create artificial intelligence, and so they create this robot, and of course it's about how to humanise that robot, and that robot becomes self-aware, but actually it's about love. It's got some queer themes in it, but it's totally family-friendly, so it's making all of these themes accessible to everyone and opening up those conversations, written by Laser Webber, a really wonderful piece that I'm really proud to bring to Adelaide Fringe.
I think I've not forgotten anything. That sounds like it at all. Was that seven? I think that's seven. How do I remember these things?
Speaker 3 21:00
I don't know, for those playing at home, please keep count and correct us if needed, but it sounds like there's something there for everyone.
Speaker 4 21:09
Should be at least one show that I bring to Adelaide that you'll like no matter who you are. So I hope there is something for everyone in there.
Speaker 3 21:18
No doubt there is, they're all, sure they'll all be successful and many people of all walks in life will go see them. When they do go see these shows, they'll be like, okay, I can trust Joanne now. I haven't met her personally, but I can trust her and I'll just go see all the other shows that she ever brings out as well. Let's move on now. Dice ready. This is a short question. Why should people go and see theatre?
Speaker 4 21:44
For... because theatre is life.
Speaker 3 21:48
Perfect. Honestly, there's no there's no follow-up on that, theatre is life.
Speaker 4 21:52
Can I say two sentences about that?
Speaker 3
Go for it.
Speaker 4
I had a moment the other day, being a new mother, you know, it's difficult for me to get out easily, thank goodness for babysitters. And I had a moment where I went to go and see a show at the Goodwood Theatre, not one of mine, a friend of mine's. And it was absolutely amazing, it was called Done to Death by Jove. And I had a surreal moment afterwards, I'd just seen this incredible piece, I was standing in the foyer, I was surrounded by old friends, by colleagues, I'd just seen this piece, and my child was being looked after by another dear friend who just said, Yep, let me have them at Knoll and you go and do the thing that you need to do.
And I was brought to tears because I realised how important it was for me to have a moment of theatre in my world, to be able to stand in that foyer and have that experience and have all of my synapses fire at all levels, and it's vital to have these experiences of art and community and expression. And so that's why, because theatre is life, it really is, and I've been reintroduced to that more than ever in my latest role as a mother.
Speaker 3 23:14
Last night I saw a show called Manbo.
Speaker 4 23:18
I've seen it. It's great, isn't it?
Speaker 3 23:20
It's incredible. It's so much fun. It's just amazing. And creative. So creative. And it's just one person, but this show was, yeah, absolutely it's life. I did not think about looking at my phone, how like 21st-2nd century, whatever we're in now, thing to say is that, but to me, almost a good show or a good time these days is something that you forget about your phone for an hour or two hours if you're going to see a movie. But the show was incredible. And I saw this performer in the bakers at Holden Street Theatres and that almost brought me to tears. It was that good. Not just from pure, absolute, chaotic hilarity, but just because it was a beautiful piece of theatre and these are three performers at the top of their game.
And so Manbo was just something that I saw based off of that they had the bakers in brackets and it was just incredible. And who knows how long we actually have left to actually see that in Australia. But yes, theatre is life. Theatre is something you can talk about with your friends. It's a special memory that you'll think about or you'll think back on, maybe when times are tough and something will remind you of this show that you saw.
And so yeah, theatre is life. So the last question before we wrap up is just quite simply, could you tell us about how we can follow and support you in your career? Okay. Here we go.
Speaker 4 24:51
Nine. Okay. Social media. Facebook. Instagram. Twitter. Not TikTok. Media. Websites. Telling friends. I think I'm done. Telling friends. I think that's actually really important. Adelaide works on word of mouth, right?
Speaker 3 25:13
Absolutely.
Speaker 4
My child is having word of mouth at the moment as well. Telling us.
Speaker 3 25:17
Clearly telling us to wrap things up. We will definitely post all the links that Joanne gives to us and we'll provide links in the episode description of how you can support Joanne and her work to all of the social media sites and websites so you can stay abreast of what's going on in her creative world. So that's it. Thank you everyone for tuning in to Artists on Earth. Please like, follow and subscribe and share before we say goodbye, before we conclude with Vitaly Levkin's You Can Do More, Lemon Music Studios. We'll post the links. Here's a sample of Joanne's work. Good night, everybody.
Speaker 5 26:31 (SONG)
I long to be out in the sun With no work to be done Under that morning, the cold sky Stretching and yawning And let the world go, drifting by I wouldn't be through the deep, angled wild wood Calming sheep, till I sleep like a childhood With a great big voice full of books to read Where it's peaceful While I'm killing time Being lazy With a great big voice full of books to read Where it's peaceful While I'm killing time Being lazy...
Speaker 2 28:47
You've been listening to Emerging Writers, this week featuring Matthew Erdely and Joanne Hartstone - in conversation on Matthew's podcast, Artists Unearthed, which is available on Spotify and reproduced here with Matthew and Joanne's kind permission. The theme music that Matthew uses for Artists Unearthed is You Can Do More by Vitaly Levkin. Emerging Writers can be heard at the same time each week here on Vision Australia Radio, VA Radio on Digital, online at varadio.org and also on Vision Australia Radio podcasts where you can catch up on earlier episodes.
Speaker 1 29:40
Thanks for listening to this Vision Australia Radio podcast. Don't forget to subscribe on your preferred podcast platform. Visit vairadio.org for more.
Speaker 2 29:51
Vision Australia Radio... Blindness, Low vision, Opportunity.
