Tracey O'Callaghan (part 2)

Speaker 1 00:02

This is a Vision Australia radio podcast.

Speaker 2 00:18

On Vision Australia Radio, welcome to our conversations on the work and experiences of emerging writers. I'm Kate Cooper and our guest on today's program is Tracey O'Callaghan, writer, poet, storyteller, wordweaver, spoken word performer and fitness instructor. We spoke with Tracy last week about performing her poetry at events around Adelaide and internationally, as well as taking part in poetry slams. And we talked about Tracey's book, which was launched in 2023, titled Brains, Balls and Banter. Tracey, welcome back to the program. I'm going to begin with a question that I've asked other poets on this program. Would you tell us about your earliest memories of working creatively?

Speaker 3 01:14

Well I started writing around 13 or 14 years old. I had a fascination with words and stories and I started reading my Nan's Mills and Boons at nine and had a love for books. I could lose myself in a book and transfer myself into another zone.

Speaker 3 01:31

I get lost in the fictional stories and I also kept diaries as a child and still have some. They are hilarious. I was a very factual child and not good at fabricating or fibbing, but I would document everything.

Speaker 2 01:45

Aha, now that's interesting, so very factual and and yet very very creative as well. Tracey, in last week's conversation we mentioned that you have your own website, The Queen of Sass, on which our listeners can access video recordings of your performances. On your website, the musician and artist Jack Vol writes, Tracy's work is highly charged with her unique energy and filled to the brim with sassiness, but it's not a hollow nihilistic sass, more of an intelligent and playful bulshiness that, along with her signature wit and charisma, serves to set very clear boundaries regarding what she will and won't tolerate.

Speaker 2 02:31

Great words, I have a couple of questions here. Firstly, would you give our listeners your web address again and tell us about what else you have on that site?

Speaker 3 02:42

Okay, first, can I just say that Jack Vol and what he wrote, not a lot of people can make me tear up, but he made me tear up. I've never been told I've had charisma. That was a pretty awesome day. And Cammy, what he wrote, he did the same thing. I just, I had to just sit down. They... knocked me for a six with the, with what they wrote. So that means a lot to me to have that support around me in the creative arts community. And back to what your question was, my website once again is the queenofsass.com.au ... I smile every time that I say that is because I could not believe that had not been taken when I, let's just go the queen of SASS. 

So on my website, I have an intro of all about my poetry journey from 2018. Some of my performances can be seen on there. As we said, my book launch is on there, the whole performance. There's a radio interview with Peter Goers. You can also order my book, Brains, Balls and Banter. And it's all there for you to view. Enjoy.

Speaker 2 03:51

That's great. And what's the story behind the name which no one else had thought to take? The Queen of Sass?

Speaker 3 03:58

Well this may shock everybody but I've actually been called sassy. So, and the Queen of Sass, here she is, the Queen of Sass. Look, I like it, it's better than some things I've been called - and it does reflect on my performance style... but Tracy McNally officially named and crowned me with an actual hand-crafted crown back in 2021, and the name has stuck. I still have the crown.

Speaker 2 04:26

Tracey, and that sassiness does come through your poetry in the form of a real confidence. And you mentioned before about not having fear when you were performing your poem, I Raised a Daughter. That must all be part of that sassiness. It's rising above fear and being confident about your own voice.

Speaker 3 04:55

But that took years, like I would practice in the mirror and go, Oh, you know. And the fear would be tapping on the shoulder going, Oh, are you gonna get up there and do this? So I stopped performing in front of the mirror. I'm going, I don't need to do that. And I just going, I'm going to do it. What is the worst that can happen to me? Nothing. And I, like I said, I made my excitement and my nerves meet in the middle and behave.

Speaker 2 05:23

And they certainly do. And while we're talking about the story behind the name, would you tell us about the term wordweaver, which is used on your website? It's a beautiful expression. I love it. How did it come about?

Speaker 3 05:38

I just like, it's like anything with my writing. I just sort of came up with it. And I've used the term in a friendship way with people I've met in the creative arts community here in Adelaide, because this is a whole new thing for me. I'm a sports person. Like I hid my writing. So, you know, like people are going, what are you doing now? I haven't seen me for five years. And they go, oh, poetry and their shadows go down. I'm going, Oh, I don't have to discuss it anymore. Do you know, so this is, it's just, yeah, it is what it is, word weaving. I use the term, how you going, you amazing word weaver? 

It's just got to flow. Word weaving has a certain tone to it. It's musical. It's a mellow. It's like a beat. And I often find myself writing to a beat. I'll get a song in my head and I'll actually write a poem from the beat of that song. And Avalanche is another amazing poet that I know quite well has told me, Yes, you write to a beat.

Speaker 2 06:37

Thank you. Tracey, you just mentioned before about being a sports person, and we said in the introduction that you're a fitness instructor. So tell us about that side of your life and your work.

Speaker 3 06:48

Well, I'm a fitness instructor, a programs and activities officer. I've been doing that since 2012. It's just something I love. I was always fascinated. I wanted to be a PE teacher as a kid, but I was told that I wouldn't be good enough. So I'm going, all right, pack that one in my pocket and listen to them. But I became a coach, a netball coach in my old high school. I've made state level sport in softball and soccer here in South Australia, softball and Tasmania. I've been a soccer coach. So it's just rewarding, so rewarding again. And the fitness sessions I run now is boxing and I have clients I've had for over nine years. It's rewarding going on their journey and making it fun, not something they hate to do.

Speaker 2 07:36

Sounds brilliant - and it must be very gratifying too that we're at a time finally where women's soccer has the same profile, if not at the moment a greater profile than men's soccer, and so many young people young boys young girls are taking up soccer or being really interested in becoming soccer fans...

Speaker 3 08:01

Yes, that is brilliant, because the less time on the blue screen and more time out on that grass and nature and getting, working with the team is exactly what you need. They're going amazing. We were laughed at when we were in the state back then because we should have been, I don't know, home baking or something, but that wasn't me. So I'm very proud of the Matildas and just so much soccer going on now. Anything that gets our kids away from the blue screen and out into nature, I'm all for it, Kate.

Speaker 2 08:31

Absolutely. Enjoying the beautiful game. Yes. Tracey, would you perform another of your spoken word poems for us?

Speaker 3 08:39

Definitely will. The next poem I'm going to perform is, it's a given a voice to men and it has created some feedback and meeting some amazing young boys and men. I dedicate this to all the men. 

Oh to be a boy or man, to achieve a big gut not be asked how long you got to go. Men get to pat each other on the back celebrating their burps and their farts, telling each other mate, that was a work of art. Boys get to stay out late no curfews on their first date. Boys get more food on their plate and another notch on their belt makes them a man. Oh but men, men are the glue in keeping the family together. They are the storytellers, the rocks, they leave a legacy hand down history like an old grandfather clock. They pass on parts they pass and there are parts will tear you apart and others will bring on a good belly laugh.

Men are strength to the core, baritone's beautiful sounds but men keep their pain and their tears in a box locked key lost and statistics are still one in four and those men don't get to walk back through their doors and we are still telling our boys to suck up their tears. Big boys don't cry, grow up hair, man up, step up. Well it is time for us to wake up or we will be picking up the pieces of another broken man. So I don't ever want to be a boy or man. Unrealistic expectation placed in our hands so let's hold out our hands to our men when you are a mother, daughter, sister, friend or wife. Keep that door open for the men in your life.

Speaker 2 10:40

There are numbers of very personal themes that come through your poetry, Tracey. One is about dialogue, about people speaking with one another, about opening up rather than closing in. That's very strong in that poem.

Speaker 3 10:58

It is, and a poem, I wrote that because the statistics of our boys and men taking their own lives is a lot higher than the women, and this is not women versus female, our men are taking their lives and it needs to stop and we need to know why and we need to keep the doors open and create that conversation.

Speaker 2 11:17

Thanks, Tracey. And if our conversation is raising any issues for you or someone you know, please call 1-800-RESPECT. That's 1-800-737-732... or Lifeline on 13 11 14. Tracey, we've talked about community and about support in our conversation. Would you share with us your reflections on being part of the community of spoken word poets here in Adelaide?

Speaker 3 11:53

The spoken word community here in Adelaide is like a second home for me now. I just have been so lucky meeting so many diverse, different, amazing people who have taken the time to have a conversation with me and support me and encourage me. And I have friends from this. I definitely know now that I have finally found my tribe.

Speaker 2 12:23

That's really inspiring and really encouraging and it is a fantastic community and very vibrant and there are so many events in and around Adelaide and in South Australia for people to go to.

Speaker 3 12:37

It has grown so much from 2018 and we want the young people, want the older people, want everybody coming out and having a voice in a safe space.

Speaker 2 12:53

On Vision Australia Radio, you're listening to our conversation program Emerging Writers. Our guest today is Tracey O 'Callaghan, writer, poet, storyteller, wordweaver, spoken word performer and fitness instructor. Tracey, how do your experiences of performing your poetry influence the way you create your work?

Speaker 3 13:18

I sort of keep that one simple. Some of my poems are very relatable to people and it's just about what's happened in life and memories and I like to push the buttons sometimes but they come up. People come up to me and they speak to me after a performance and I may be inspired to write another poem on the topic as subject of the poem due to the feedback I get back. So I just sort of write and I perform. I don't think too much about it.

Speaker 2 13:50

And just getting the feedback must be a really good feeling, a really good experience to have that interaction with people responding to your work.

Speaker 3 14:01

Yes, because it ranges from young people around 14 thanking me for doing a poem about standing up for young boys and men, to people in their 80s or 90s that again, men, older men, saying thank you for being a voice for us men. They're very profoundly, they affect me - and I get constructive criticism, it's always constructive, you know some people don't like one of my poems - that's okay also, because that's what it's about, you don't have to like everybody's poem, but I aim to inspire people to pick up a pen and write and get the stuff out of their heart and head and we'll help them.

Speaker 2 14:42

That's wonderful. Tracey, when you're not writing or performing your poetry, what do you like doing?

Speaker 3 14:48

I try to do things that calm me down - and that sort of doesn't work because I have got a lot of energy. I try very much to get to the beach. Even in winter, I like walking bare feet and having a paddle. And I love going anywhere. There was big trees that I can lay under and read and just have time out. And I do like reading fictional books and spending time with my family and friends. I spend time with the people who now accept me for who I am, the ones that are not trying to shape me to be something I'm not.

Speaker 2 15:25

I know from the Poetry at the Port event that you're also a brilliant and super speedy crocheter.

Speaker 3 15:34

Alright, yes I like to crochet. Now the reason I like to crochet is because I was taught this by my grandmother, by my nan. I knitted her a rug when I was 16 and I knit because I crochet because I'm a nightmare to watch a movie with so to keep me sitting I decided to crochet. I'm the poetry of End of Port and I have made many crochet rugs with a few people laugh at me but that's okay. It's a skill my grandmother passed on to me.

Speaker 2 16:14

I found it quite mesmerizing to watch. You and I were sitting next to each other at the Poetry at the port and yes, I was watching the performers... but every now and again I just watch your fingers moving so quickly and I think, She doesn't drop a stitch, and it's just this rug was growing in front of me. It was fascinating. It was like...

Speaker 3 16:38

Thank you, I do enjoy doing it - and people get lots of gifts I might have to make you...

Speaker 2 16:45

OK, I wasn't hinting, but I'd love one. Tracey, you mentioned your grandmother before, and you're originally from Devonport in Tasmania. Another question that I've been asking on this program is about where our guests are from. We've got listeners to our podcast from around the world who may not be familiar with different places in Australia. So would you tell us first where Devonport is located in Tasmania, and then also what that place means to you?

Speaker 3 17:16

So, Devonport is located in the northwest of Tasmania, so that's where the Abel Tasman comes in from Victoria, from Melbourne. So that docks in at East Devonport. So it's, look, a lot of people are coming over to Tassie now, it's a small place, but the northwest is the best, and that was part of one of the songs we used to sing when we go down and play against Hobart softball in carnivals. So, look, it was a place that... the air is just nicer over there, less fog and everything. The beach, I was 10 minutes from the beach, just from bullshit, it was just amazing. It's just so many memories of growing up in nature and going back and catching up with friends and family. I go back, say, every year, year and a half.

Speaker 2 18:05

And that's where your love of sport to your love of getting out as you say in nature and keeping moving?

Speaker 3 18:13

Yeah, I've always been like that. I think my mother was very grateful and that I did something and my teachers were extremely grateful that I took up sport. Because I actually, to start with, I was a pretty useless kid. I had two left feet. I never got picked in any teams. And so I taught myself. Each skill I taught myself because they wouldn't let me in the team. So I taught myself and then I went back and I showed them.

Speaker 2 18:37

Tracey, you mentioned walking on the beach and I would love you to do another poem for us.

Speaker 3 18:46

Well, I say, how about we do the one that I wrote after doing a Sea Shepherd beach cleanup pick-up? It goes like this... 

She speaks to us from deep down in her depths, delivering her gifts on a wave tips. They come from near and far. There's plastic stalks and plastic forks left by inconsiderate dorks, plastic bags and plastic plates left by you and your mates. You bring all your rubbish to her shores, have parties, watch your children play and explore. The [?neevel], you wrap and line around and break the law. There's plastic spoons and bottle caps. No time to pick up your crap, but plenty of time to flick through your apps. You post on social media how much you love this place, pucker up, make a duck face, the neevel, your shit huff embedded in the sand.

Try using those things at the end of your wrist. They're called hands. There's beer bottles, coat cans, shards of broken glass, cigarette butts left by disrespectful nuts and plastic knives that still cut. There's broken thongs about their mates, broken plastic crates and still McDonald's signature straws. You know, she teaches us lessons each time we meet. Purge in a banquet of gifts at our feet, the sea life strangled in fishing line. Don't you think it's time we showed some respect for this, our sacred land that we continue to neglect?

Speaker 2 20:31

Tracey, that's a timely reminder because I'm always shocked when I'm out for a walk and I see rubbish everywhere. I just, I still can't believe it after all these years. What's the story behind that poem from your experience?

Speaker 3 20:47

Okay, so I wrote that poem because my daughter kept on nicking off overseas, and she was a Sea Shepherd supporter and used to help them out all the time, so she would ask me to buy clothes, anything. And she had quite a cupboard full of them. So while she was overseas, they had a Sea Shepherd cleaner down at Glenelg. So I went through a whole wardrobe and dressed myself in all her clothes, sent a photo through and said, I'm going down on behalf of you. I did it as a bit of a stir actually, but I was extremely shocked and disgusted as a human to see what we cleaned up. 

And to be honest, one of the biggest shock was McDonald's - to stop their yellow straws, their red stripe, and still they are coming up on the beach. So it's, I went home and I wrote She Speaks on behalf of the sea speaking to us.

Speaker 2 21:42

And I hope people are listening because certainly those clean-up days, those clean-up exercises are so important to keep our natural areas beautiful.

Speaker 3 21:55

It definitely is, and it does not take much to leave the place the way you feel, found it.

Speaker 2 22:00

Precisely. Tracey, as we speak, winter is settling in in Adelaide. So what are you working on now and what are you looking forward to?

Speaker 3 22:14

I continually work on first drafts, so I have over a couple of hundred of first drafts. So when I make time and space, that's when I have to leave the house. I sometimes go to the library and work as well, or there's nobody in the house. I put wood on the fire, I get a coffee, and I get all these rough notes I've pulled together and quick, odd writing and all my recorded things. And I start to form all my poetry again. And I attend open mic nights and catching up with all the people that I love being around.

Speaker 2 22:54

Sounds brilliant, and as we've mentioned on previous episodes of the program, if you check in on the internet, Adelaide Poetry, Poetry Geek Guide, you can find out places to go to hear spoken word poets performing, including Tracey. Would you tell us your web address again so that our listeners can access more of your poetry?

Speaker 3 23:23

The web address is www.thequeenofsass.com.au and my Facebook page is Pissed Off Poet. Don't hesitate to send a message through or a friend request. I'm quite happy to go there and another way you can get a book if you'd like a book. Thank you.

Speaker 2 23:43

Thank you so much, Tracey. Our guest on Emerging Writers today was Tracey O 'Callaghan, writer, poet, storyteller, wordweaver, spoken word performer, and fitness instructor. And before we go, a special thanks to new Vision Australia radio volunteer Matthew Erdely for editing this interview. This program is produced in our Adelaide studios and can be heard at the same time each week here on Vision Australia Radio, VA Radio on Digital, online at vairadio .org, and also on Vision Australia Radio podcasts, where you can catch up on earlier episodes.

Speaker 1 24:43

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Speaker 2 24:53

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