Orion Kelly - That Autistic Guy

Speaker 1 00:00

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Speaker 2 00:20

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Speaker 3 00:32

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Speaker 4 00:47

I would like to begin by paying my respects to the Wurundjeri people of the Kulin Nation, who are the traditional custodians of the land on which I am coming to you from today. Land where at brainwaves we tell our stories, and land where the traditional custodians have told their stories for many, many years before us, and continue to tell their stories. I would like to pay my respects to Elders past and present, and acknowledge all Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander listeners who are listening today.

Speaker 5 01:18

Hello, welcome to Brainwaves on 3CR 855 AM, 3CR Digital Radio and 3CR.org.au. My name is Kaylin and now I'm going to hand you over to Suzy.

Speaker 6 01:29

Hello everyone my name is Suzy Leach - and today I'm thrilled to bits to get to chat with Orion Kelly. I discovered Orion on YouTube where he is known as that autistic guy. I actually can't recall why I started to follow him but it was probably his sense of humor which I find absolutely hilarious and very similar to mine it's a sort of a bit of a black sense of humor. Now just a little bit about Orion Kelly. After he left school Orion studied law before drastically changing career plans and then spending 25 years in commercial radio. Orion's also worked as an actor and been a presenter on TV working for numerous commercial stations but most importantly Orion is a husband and father of two boys one of whom is autistic and following an adult diagnosis of autism and ADHD.

Orion has himself worked tirelessly as an advocate to raise public understanding acceptance and appreciation for people who are autistic or who have other neurodiverse conditions such as ADHD and Asperger's syndrome. Orion aims to remove misconceptions and improve opportunities for all neurodiverse people. Apart from Orion's highly popular YouTube channel which is well worth following he's authored the book Autism Feels and Earthlings Guide and he is a consultant and a keynote speaker on autism and other conditions and I can highly recommend the book which I've read this week very readable you just can't put it down basically if it's a subject that interests you it's very well written.
So without further ado hello Orion Kelly and welcome to Brainwaves.

Speaker 7 03:20

Thank you, Susie. I appreciate your time. Presumably we're out of time now. That was the longest intro I've ever had in my life. So thank you for having me and we'll talk to you later.

Speaker 6 03:28

Yeah, thank you. Ryan, very briefly, can you tell our listeners what exactly is autism and how is it acquired?

Speaker 7 03:38

Yep, no worries. So basically, in general terms, because I'm not a doctor or a healthcare practitioner, I can tell you that autism is a neurodevelopmental condition. It's basically a medically diagnosed and recognised disability. So it is the brain. There is nothing about your body that is autistic. It's purely being born with a brain that's wired differently. And you said acquired, which is a great word or a great question to ask because you can acquire the flu, or you can acquire education in the law, you can't acquire autism, you're born with it and you die with it.

So the specific to answer that more and I'm an autistic guy on big on words, but the specific answer that question is we don't know that there's a genetic component. You so it's one of the biggest ways you're going to be born autistic is because you have an autistic mother or father or you have an autistic, you know, grandmother or grandfather. But, you know, that is primarily the reason, but not only the reasons and and then it starts to go into the rabbit warren of myths that the same old rubbish that people say causes it. But in effect, you can't, you can't get it later in life.

So bad parenting didn't make your child autistic. They were either born autistic or they're not. So that's probably the best, the most simple way of describing it. You've heard, you've mentioned it a few different ways. So there's there's ASD, there's Autism Spectrum Disorder. There's, you know, there's Autism, there's autistic, you know, there's Asperger's Syndrome, which you've mentioned, which isn't actually even recognised as anything in most parts of the world. Now, I think it's still diagnosable in some countries, but [?DSM] five just got rid of it. It's just if you, you know, that's what we now class as autism. So, yeah, I think that's probably the best way of putting it. It's a different brain. It's a different operating system.

Speaker 6 05:35

Right, a different wiring. Yeah. Look, I'm interested to know how you came to get the diagnosis because I know that you said you were diagnosed as an adult and what caused that to happen? How old were you and what's the story around that please?

Speaker 7 05:53

Yes. So primarily, you know, when you're diagnosing a medical condition or a disability, you know, you have the medical knowledge of the time on how to recognise the symptoms or the traits or whatever. This guy's legs don't work or, you know, this person's deaf, right? Now, autism is obviously very different. The thing about autism is because it's a spectrum for the large portion of time, medical practitioners were only looking for, you know, what you would class as a very severe end of the spectrum. So, you know, they they would in effect be young white boys who didn't talk and may have had intellectual disabilities. And that's the myth. See, that's a that's a co-occurring condition, but it's not part of autism.

There's no, there's no there's no person born autistic who has an intellectual disability. They're born with that and a co-occurring condition. So, from my point of view, what you would what you would class as a late diagnosis is is probably the most common diagnosis of my time now, because I'm in effect a part of a lost generation. Now, when I say generation, it's more because I speak to people in their 60s, 70s and 80s through my YouTube channel every day who have just, you know, found a diagnosis, because we have to think about this. Why is it a lost generation? 

When we were kids, ain't no doctor looking at us. For starters, we might not have been whites. We might not have been a boy. We might have been able to talk. We might have been able to hold a conversation. We might have been smart. Ain't no doctor looking at that person and going, Oh, yeah, that's an autistic person. They're going, Oh, that's a normal person who's just to be anxious, or who's very good at being friends with people, right? So, because the medical knowledge was so, you know, so small. And again, this is an issue because autism is only the brain and the brain is the one part of the body we probably still know nothing about.

So it's, you know, it's a long journey. But so the late diagnosis came about, like all late diagnosed people as a rule, because of a kid. You have a kid and the kid's, you know, and the kid quite early in life, probably between five and eight is diagnosed. And in the diagnosis process, you're forced to confront autism and you're forced to fill out 100,000 forms. And then your wife or your husband or your partner starts going, this is just like you. All these are you. And that's the experience, you know, I had. And at the time I was dealing with, you know, different issues, and that all made sense. And that, and then, of course, I saw the diagnosis - which is extremely hard, by the way.

08:24

There's a lot of adults being misdiagnosed, especially women. Oh, no, you're not autistic, you know, you're Borderline Personality Disorder or this or that. It just, and it's just rubbish. So it's very hard because a lot of the psychiatrists were trained to diagnose kids because only kids are autistic, but of course kids grow up. Yeah. So there are, there are adult autistic people because all kids grow up. So it's very hard to find a psychiatrist who can actually diagnose effectively autistic adults. And that's why, that's why I was lucky, you know, having a son, breaking news, the first person on the planet that said they were lucky to have an autistic son, trust me, come and have him for a day and you, you'll never say that.

But the bottom line is, because of the son, because of our son and going through his experience with him, we were diagnosed within the space of a month, both my son and I. So, you know, him, him at, I don't know, was it five and me and my 30s? I mean, that's a big gap, but it's really, we're diagnosed. So, you know, but for my son, I may not have been diagnosed. And, you know, but for autism, I'd probably be dead because I was out. I'd had enough. Life was too hard and I didn't know why. So it's actually really important, the late diagnosis and the idea that, yes, someone didn't just walk up to Mount Everest and it popped up that day. Yeah, Mount Everest, Mount Everest was there.

Yes. This hadn't been discovered. It's the same as late diagnosis. You didn't just invent it. And it's not a fad. And it's the people say the numbers are growing. That's actually, it's actually rubbish with the, with the ratio of the population on the planet and the, and the ability to diagnose in a more sophisticated fashion. We're still underdiagnosing. So, you know, you hear these idiots online talk about, you know, oh, everyone's autistic these days. It's just not true. So, yeah, so that's, that's, that's my story. And that's everyone's story I talk to late diagnosed. It's a child or a friend or a family member.

Speaker 6 10:11

Yeah, and did your wife have any idea beforehand or a few suspicions or...?

Speaker 7 10:16

Yes. My wife and I, my wife had brought it up and we'd actually talked about it prior to the diagnosis. In fact, I think it might have been around the birth of our son. Being an autistic baby, autistic babies, you know, are really tricky to deal with. They're criers, they're emotional. Of course, they hate transitions. You don't realise this right. So, you know, everyone tells you, you know, when you have a baby, it's, you know, it's an amazing time, great time or the first few weeks are the worst and it gets better. And that's just like the dust. That isn't the truth for us. So she did bring it up early, early, early. And my initial reaction was Get stuffed, I don't know what you're talking about. 

And I think that, looking back now, I think that's because it resonated so deeply with me. It scared me. And I didn't want to open myself up to being classed as something that, you know, that I had, I knew nothing about. This is why when I started my podcast, my YouTube channel, it wasn't because I was an expert. It was because I wanted to force myself to learn everything I could about being autistic to try and improve my son's life. That's why I did it, to basically force myself to learn. And, you know, a few years on, I've gone from absolutely nothing to, you know, to knowing so much more than I ever thought I'd know. And I guess that's probably, that's the key. It's, you know... it's developing an understanding later in life. And that's really helped me in, you know, in my journey.

Speaker 6 11:38

Well that's good to hear. What exactly was your experience of childhood, for example, like when you're a kid, how did it feel compared to neurotypical people that you now realise you weren't neurotypical looking back? What was the feelings around that?

Speaker 7 11:57

Yeah. So I mean, as a child, I didn't know I had a condition and the name of the condition, but I was completely aware that I was, I was different. I was completely aware how I was bullied every day. You know, I was ostracised. I was pushed out. I didn't have a lot of friends. If I did have friends, they'd turn on me or I wouldn't be a good friend and I'd lose them. You know, and there was, there's nothing about, so obviously my family, my parents are great. There's nothing about my childhood with regards to friendships and school that I look back on fondly. Some people think, Oh, the school were the best days of your life. I hated it. I wasn't bad at it, but I hated it.

And you're going from room to room, teacher to teacher, and you're stuck outside or, you know, like the interaction. So, you know, core significant past the point a neurotypical can understand significant challenges in interactions and communication. Can you imagine having that as a young child, trying to navigate a playground or, you know, a schoolyard? My only saving grace, people resonate with it now because it's a lot more polished was humour. My only saving grace was to use humour. That's why it's part of my DNA. But no, I never felt neurotypical. I just didn't know that's what I felt. So, I thought I was just different to the point where no one wanted to accept me. They didn't want to reject me. 

And then as I got a bit older, I felt like I'm just a bad person. I was just born to suffer. I was just born to not have friends and people not like me. I was born for things to not go right because in a neurotypical world, hence my book and Earthlings guide, in a neurotypical world, I am, I feel like I'm an alien on an alien planet. It's no different to me getting you and saying, you know, Congratulations, you've got a new job, you're moving to France tomorrow and you having no choice. Now, I'm not, you might speak French. I'm saying it as a, just an example. Yes. That would be a very good life for you. If you want to move to France tomorrow and start a new job where you can only speak French, you wouldn't, you don't know the language. You don't know the customs. You don't know who, you don't have any friends. 

So, welcome to every single day for an autistic person. And it's not something you can, you can like, oh, just learn it. No, just your brain doesn't work like that. So, you can't heal up the brain. It's a different brain. So, you've got kids going to school every day, like my nine-year-old son. He, the bullying is just, it's just, it's like, you know, you tie your shoe, he gets bullied. That's just, so, you know, and so that's the experience you have in childhood and in life. And people don't look at it like that, but I'd like to see them start a whole new life in a new country where the customs and languages are different and see how they go or even die because I've been doing it my whole life.

Speaker 6 14:37

Yeah, I'm not autistic to my knowledge. I do... some of the traits that you describe in your book I relate to and that's possibly also why you get your sense of humour - but I also feel sometimes like I was born on the wrong planet too, so I feel yeah but possibly for different reasons. Now talking about briefly about traits, what are the traits that you have and we're just looking at the time - but essentially very briefly because we haven't got time to go into ADHD today. Can you just tell us how that interacts a little bit with your actual traits? So there's most significant traits for you. Autistic traits did you say? Yeah, so the most significant autistic traits that you deal with.

Speaker 7 15:26

Yeah. Well, I think the biggest challenges for me are clearly in the first category of diagnosis, social and communication and interaction. They're clearly my biggest issues. And that's not something to ask me about how I experience autism and do it in a nutshell is not something I can provide for you. I can't give you that. I'm sorry. That's okay. So yeah, social and communication interactions are clearly an issue. Sensory sensitivities are clearly an issue in my capacity. And that's actually another part of it. People don't realise part of the diagnostic criteria are also it's also based on capacity. So in effect, my challenges in effect, bring my capacity down to the point where I'm unable to meet the stresses and demands of life. That's actually part of the diagnostic criteria. 

So being autistic lowers my capacity. Being a father and a husband, maybe that's the stupidest thing I ever did, but it saved my life. And it's hard. It's triggering. So I think it's very more respectful of I just leave it at that rather than try to come across generic in a ten second sound bite for you. That's in effect.

Speaker 6 16:36

Yeah, so I know in your book you talk about having difficulty socialising, so that was the first category, and how you like things to be - which I do too, regimented, and you do things in a regimented way. Like there's a particular chapter where you talk about what's involved in having a shower for you - I found that very interesting. And you said the sensory traits, I'm guessing you mean too much going on, too much external stimulation is triggering for you.

Speaker 7 17:11

Yeah. So sensory sensitivity, part of autism, is a hyper or a hypo. So a hyper means a heightened and hypo means an under. So for example, I might have a hypo under sensitive, sensitivity to pain. Right. So like, oh, you know, I literally fell over playing footy and my wrist was the wrong way around and I didn't even realise it for a while. It never hurt. OK. I didn't. And they cracked it back in like it would break in a ruler at school. Right. And then we're all sweet. But then again, you know, if there's a smell, what's that smell? No one can smell but me. Well, until I can work out what the smell is and where it is and to get rid of it, I can't live life.

Oh, you know, what's that noise? I'm always a person. What was that? Did you hear that? And I have superhero hearing if you ask my wife, you know, and other people can trigger me. I can be the noisiest eater, but if you eat noise, noisily, you know, I'm going to banish you to the next country. Right. So, you know, it's like there's the sensitivity is part of it. And yes, restricted and repetitive routines is a core part of autism. We rely on routines and sameness because we are dysregulated in an alien planet and therefore we can find things to maintain our regulation. We can thrive in this planet. Yes. And that's in effect, you know, one of the ways of explaining how it feels. Yeah.

And a key thing too is, well, for me, I think neurodiversity is a wonderful thing and it would be just totally and utterly boring if everyone was exactly the same. And there's so much that different people have to contribute to society and so on.

Speaker 6 18:40

Can you, just for our listeners, are there any other major traits that other people may experience?

Speaker 7 18:50

Yeah. So I mean, the thing about autism, because it is a, an infinite spectrum. It's not that people think there's a, there's a like a linear end, like there's a light and hard or soft and whatever, you know, low and high and all that kind of stuff. That's so, it's... an infinite color wheel. So to be able to, you know, answer that question is, you know, would be virtually impossible because it is infinite, but, but clearly, you know, the challenges are personal. I guess I'm struggling with this question because, you know, every single person's brain experiences the world differently because of their autistic brain and it'd be hard for me to get into their shoes and tell you other traits.

19:31

But, you know, the, of the main categories, you know, social interaction and communication, you know, I may be very standoffish and very hard to understand and very, very fun and hard to warm up and enjoy social situations, right? Where my son, he may struggle in the same way by being the reverse. He might not get personal space. He might not get too much information. He might not get walking up to a stranger and starting to talk to them, not hello. I'm just starting to talk to them where for me, I couldn't think of anything worse. So you can get some autistic people who, you know, may not understand personal space or too much information or personal information.

Like, you know, I can do a live stream with my nine-year-old because people love to see him, but he, you know, he will, he doesn't realise it. Just say, say our address or his number or his school. You got to be careful what you say, buddy. He thinks it's funny. He doesn't understand that. You know, the sensory stuff some people might experience, like I said, they might not, they might not feel pain. You know, all they, they might, they might require immense deep pressure when it comes to regulation or hugs. They hate light hugs. They're like bare hugs that break your ribs. They don't realise they're doing that, though, you know, and that this is similar with relationships.

People think autistic people, you know, are rude or potentially in relationships when, in fact, it's not about their rudeness. It's about their inability to understand that being logical, truthful, open and honest and straightforward is not, is not, not acceptable in New York. So, and that's the key issue for us. You've made the rule saying honesty is the best policy, but then you've, you've punished us when we stick by your policy. So of course, your policy is a load of rubbish. It isn't the best policy. It's the worst policy. If you be honest with someone, that's the worst thing you can do. That's what I've learned. So, you know, and so that's how that they can manifest differently, but it will be so wrong of me to try and give you a good legitimate kind of insight into other people's experiences. You'd have to ask them.

Speaker 6 21:35

I know that for those that are interested, Orion covers some of the other traits that people experience in his book. You've already said that I was going to ask you about how the diagnosis changed your life and was it for the good or for the bad or a bit of both. You've already said that it has had a positive impact. Were there negative impacts from finding the diagnosis for you? 

Speaker 7 22:04

Yeah, definitely. Definitely. There's negative impacts for everyone. I mean, there's a honeymoon period and then there's a grieving period. And it's kind of like you go through the stages of grief, really. That's how it feels because, you know, you feel, Oh, I'm not a bad person. I'm not broken. I'm autistic. I'm different. But then you realise, But hang on, what have I missed out on? You know, what's happened to half my life? Where did it go? Where to now? Who am I? Who was I? And then you start to get angry. It's literally like grief, you know, like, bloody hell, couldn't people picked it up seriously? What's wrong with these people? You know, and you go through these phases.

But what I will say is 1000% there is there is clearly negative aspects to, you know, being diagnosed or the diagnosis. And mostly it's for the stuff that's important like employment. Good luck disclosing it to an employer and expecting to be treated better or given the things you're entitled to get good luck. Because I'm sorry, but it's just not going to happen. You know, they're legally required to give you adjustments, not going to do it. They're going to make excuses or push you out. You know, good luck disclosing it to people in relationships for some people that, you know, don't want to accept that, you know, and not to mention, you know, good luck in life.

Like some states in Australia, you might not be able to keep your license. So and I've done videos on this look because I looked into the law because that's obviously that's my thing. And that's actually not true. You just you only actually have to tell these particular states that if you believe it actually significantly impairs your ability to drive. Now, of course, that's something you could answer yourself for your GP can answer. But, you know, it just shows though. And that's another hoop I've got to go through. I've got to somehow come to the conclusion that my autism is not going to affect my driving. It's like, what does that mean?

But it didn't affect me 10 years ago before my diagnosis. Does it just happen? Is the problem just happening now? No, that's wrong. Yeah. So, you know, but, you know, I don't sound, I don't mean to sound negative or pessimistic, but, you know, I try to do a lot of work in the employment sector, but I've given up. I won't do many more. I just don't I don't need their time or their money because they want me to be there tick a box when they never listen and they move on. They don't actually care about neurodiversity in the workplace because in the end, we are different.

24:14

So we have we have amazing positives. But if the only if your only option is to is to keep neurotypical people comfortable and happy, then we're never going to get an opportunity because we're different. It's not our job to keep, it's not our job to make you happy. It's our job to do our job.

Speaker 6 24:32

A loss for the corporate and workplace sector as well because all the contributions you could make because of the way you think differently. So it's a shame. Look, Orion, what coping mechanisms have you developed and what interventions have helped you the most?

Speaker 7 24:52

I think the core thing that I kind of have learned and try to pass on to people is, is regulation. So becoming dysregulated is the gateway to all, all pain for autistic people. Becoming dysregulated is the gateway to melting down, to shutting down. And, and if you can, if you can avoid that, that's great. But if you can't avoid that, there's a cumulative effect with enough meltdowns and shutdowns, you will experience autistic burnout. And none of these things are what you think they are in a neurotypical sense, like, Oh, Jim had a meltdown in the office today, didn't he?

Like, that's not the same. So we're talking about when the brain actually disconnects. Like, so it's like a seizure. You, you aren't in control. Once you have a meltdown or a shutdown, your autistic brain has got to the point where it's, it's actually disconnected. You can't control it. So, you know, regulating yourself in times of dysregulation will avoid those things and if you can avoid those things, your life is a thousand times better. And I, and how do you do that alone time and special interests? And again, this is part of autism. So alone time is really important. And people go, well, everyone needs me-time. And that's right. But not everyone needs a wheelchair. Okay. And autism with disability.

So autistic people need alone time. They need like every day specific when they need it. Don't say, oh, I have it every day at one o 'clock. No, no, when they feel dysregulated, they need, so my wife will say, all right, just go up to the study for a while and just have some time to yourself. She can see it or hear it and she'll allow it. Right. But that's what it is. It's getting away and resetting yourself. And a lot of times that will be doing things that bring you, you know, joy or peace or happiness. It's not sleeping or just sitting there. Of course, I love to sleep, but obviously my whole content creation is not because it's a business or for money. It's 'cause... it's my passion. Like I sure I started doing it, you know, 'cause I wanted to help people and sure it's got really big now, but I was, I still do it, just to regulate myself that that's... it brings me joy.

26:48

So really it comes down, it also comes down to the idea of partners and parents understanding that you, you have to have proper expectations. You can't put neurotypical expectations on an autistic person. Like, well, we have to go to grandma's because that's what we do. And you have to kiss from the cheek because that's what kids do. And you have to have a hug and you have to eat her food. Like, and you have to smile and say goodbye. Like why do you have to, like these aren't expectations. Did, you know, like, do you have to take that kid or do you have to go? Or can they come here? 

You know, why do you have to have three parties in one week leading up to Christmas? Do you really need to see three separate groups of people? I'm with you a hundred percent. Absolutely. These are the kind of things that people stay, that's a standard expectations, but you haven't got a standard partner or child. You've got a neurodivergent autistic partner or child. So it works both ways. It comes down to expectations both ways. And, you know, my book goes into all the different kind of insights into that. And also my wife and I, the little tips and tricks we have.

But from my point of view, it sounds simplistic. But if you can keep yourself regulated in an alien world, then you're much closer to some sort of contentment, peace, happiness than if you are just spinning around constantly just regulated. It's like you're just bouncing off, you know, a pinball machine. It's horrible. It's a horrible way to live.

Speaker 6 28:04

And that's actually, I guess the benefit of having a diagnosis and having a psychologist and people to support you and give you mechanisms for coping. Because you did say earlier, I'm presuming depression and anxiety, severe depression. So having mechanisms to regulate can only be good for your mental health. Have I got that right?

Speaker 7 28:32

Well, for the most part, I mean, I wasn't, in my case, it wasn't actually a diagnosis of clinical depression or any depression. It was a fact being autistic, undiagnosed, and not being able to put things in a place to have a good quality of life and living my life, it got to me the point where it caused me to just be over, be tired of life, which is, I know it sounds ridiculous, but autistic people can experience anxiety and depression as a matter of course, as a matter of breathing, but it doesn't mean we have depression or anxiety. And that's why it could be very confusing. But yeah, I see a psychologist still, you know, like every couple of weeks, every, you know, every few weeks, I'll talk to my psychiatrist, sorry. And you know, just talking to a therapist or a psychologist is really beneficial.

And there's different things that you realise are helpful. And that's exactly what a diagnosis can help you with, not to say that, you know, the intervention therapies that we have in this country, whether it's for kids, there's none for adults, you know, helpful as a rule. I mean, for starters, the first words, intervention. I mean, these autistic kids aren't alcoholics, for good or sakes. They're acting classes, basically. We're going to teach your kid how to be normal. But that's a whole nother, you know, topic. But frankly, you know, frankly, maybe it doesn't, maybe a diagnosis doesn't help me. Receive more things. So I was seeing a psychologist prior. She really much brought it up in one of our things.

30:02

Have you ever thought about autism as well? We've backed it up. You know, so it's an interesting thought. It's an interesting conversation to have. But I don't think Australia is doing particularly well with regards, you know, like the NDIS or the way they're currently setting up the system. And as you know, you probably read that they're in effect trying to kick out as many autistic people as they can because we cost them too much money because we make up the largest amount, which disputes the purpose of setting it up in the first place anyway. So, you know, it's a horrible to navigate. I mean, you go ahead and prove to the NDIS every year that my son is still autistic. What are you talking about?

Speaker 6 30:39

I mean, that's absolutely ridiculous, isn't it? It's beyond ridiculous, it's nonsensical. Look, Orion, we're running quickly out of time now, so I'd just like you to tell our listeners how they can find your work. So I know you're on various social media channels and so on, can you just run through your podcast and that sort of thing, please?

Speaker 7 31:00

Yeah, sure. So obviously, I've got my my YouTube channels. So if you go to YouTube, obviously, you can find me, Orion Kelly, that autistic guy, that's got all my primary videos on autism, neurodivergent stuff. And I've got my podcast YouTube channel, Orion Kelly podcasts. That's obviously the video version of my friend autism. That podcast has been around for a long time. So if you want to find my friend autism, you just got to look for it wherever you get your podcasts. That's as simple as that. 

And yeah, you'll find me on all the socials. Yeah, I mean, I don't try to promote them too much because I hate comments and messages, and I get thousands and I can't keep up. And so you can always go to my website as well, OrionKelly.com.au. But yeah, basically, you know, if you can find a video on the channel that you can send to someone and improve your quality of life, because somehow it connects with you, then that's my job done. That's all I really, really care about - validating and supporting autistic people is kind of the goal.

Speaker 6 31:58

Yeah, and you're certainly working very hard to achieve that. Look, Orion, it's been an absolute privilege, and I mean that to get you to chat to you on Brainwaves today. Your life's mission, as you've said, of advocating for neurodiverse people, particularly autistic people, is making a difference to society. I'm absolutely sure of that. I'm sure our listeners will have found your story invaluable. There will be aspects that many people will relate to. And again, thank you for coming on, and we'd love to chat to you again if you'd like to in the future.

And I'll just take this opportunity to thank Evan and Kaelin for their technical support too. Okay, thank you ever so much, Ryan. Yeah, and good luck with all your work. We wish you have continued success.

Speaker 7 32:45

Thanks, Suzy. I really appreciate it. Yeah, anytime, anytime.

Speaker 5 32:49

Thanks Orion and thanks Suzy. I hope that everyone enjoyed today's show. You can find more of our shows at our website brainwaves .org .au or on our 3CR website, 3cr.org.au, or if you happen to download your 3CR podcast. If you have a story to share, if you'd like to send us some feedback or suggestions for future shows, we'd love to hear from you, so please email us at brainwaves.wellwaves.org. Thanks everyone for listening, stay safe and we'll be back next Wednesday front of 5am for another episode of Brainwaves on 3CR.

Speaker 8 33:15

You've been listening to a 3CR podcast produced in the studios of independent community radio station 3CR in Melbourne, Australia. For more information, go to allthews.3cr.org.au