Disability, stability, baby care, sports, movies and live entertainment

00:05 S1

Hi, I'm Ameera Lee, an Australian Paralympic archer. I represented Australia in Paris and you're listening to Leisure Link with Peter Greco on the Vision Australia radio network.

00:40 S2

It's just gone 5:00 as I welcome you to Leisure Link, the program that trumps any others here on Australia radio 1197 AM in Adelaide, online at varadio.org, through the TuneIn radio app - look for Vision Australia, Radio Adelaide, your favourite podcast or streaming service via Radio Digital in Darwin. Hello to you, VA Radio digital in Adelaide. A big hello to you too. And of course, our friends listening through 103.9 Hope FM investments in Western Australia. A big hello to you and Australian Disability Media for their wonderful support as well. You can catch their website powered media - p o w e r d dot media - another place to find us. 

This is Peter Greco saying thanks so much for joining us. This program coming to you from Kaurna Land. Coming to you for a very, very shortly: we'll speak to Ameera Lee, who is just back from Paris competing in the sport of archery... we'll speak cricket with Oscar Stubbs. The Blind Ashes are about to get underway. We'll also catch up with Bree Tranter, Annika Hooper and Aimee Crathern. They will tell us about their taking over the uni bar as part of today's entertainment. Your invitation to attend on the radio is just moments away. We also have Chelsea Marchetti along, our resident physiotherapist, some really important tips regarding falls prevention. 

You'll enjoy and appreciate that we speak to John Decaux about a film just launched, At the Mercy - features the interesting aspect of mental health, particularly for people on the land. We'll also hear from Matt Craig from Resthaven talking about retirement living, some big news there just happened this week. Matt will fill us in. We'll also speak to Tony Smith from Utopia Care. They've just won an award, a national award dare I say, for their services in the National Disability Insurance sector. And Carol Tyler will join us with some news, great news. If you're a parent with disability and have mobility issues and you've got a baby, you'll want to hear this interview. An Australian invention is going to be helping you. 

Well, it's been a little while since we talked about para archery, and indeed it's been a little while since we spoke to Ameera Lee, but Ameera's on the line now. Ameera, great to catch up again. Thank you so much for your time.

03:03 S1

Thanks for having me here today, Peter.

03:05 S2

Now, you're not long back from Paris. That must be very satisfying being chosen. You were desperately unlucky to miss out on Tokyo.

03:13 S1

I was very close in Tokyo, and I guess, to be selected for Paris, it feels surreal because it was such a long haul. A journey, if you will, that four years between each Paralympic cycle and, you know, so the big trajectory just even to be selected for Paris was next level and it's still today. It's surreal.

03:34 S2

I can imagine that might be the case, actually. Well, after Tokyo's non-selection, did you kind of maybe think, Do I go on, do I not go on?

03:43 S1

No I didn't, it was a case of I, when I'm in competition, I'm competing against myself. And I guess I do that in most things. So I just want to keep improving. So I guess you could say it was a hiccup in the road. I didn't get it, but I was still, so, I guess determined to keep improving what I'm doing. And here we are on the other side.

04:04 S2

Your form's been pretty good since Tokyo. Well, it was pretty good leading into Tokyo, so we might just... leave that there. We don't get ourselves into trouble regarding your non-selection, but your form was good, and it's been good to you. So I guess if you've got that confidence in the way you're performing, that keeps it going.

04:19 S1

Absolutely. There's always room for improvement. So I guess the peak of my performance would be when I won Australian Open. So as you know, as you might know, I'm the first archer to win the Australian Open. So that was my peak. And I keep chasing that which I shouldn't do, but I yeah, I'll keep improving and yeah, keep going forward.

04:40 S2

The Australian Open - I mean that is against all comers. So yes at the Paralympics you compete against people with other disabilities or with disabilities. But the Australian Open was against all comers.

04:49 S1

Correct. Yes. So there's no handicaps whatsoever. Everyone's on a level playing field.

04:54 S2

It's a tremendous achievement and might be hard to top for archers going forward.

04:59 S1

I'm sure that, I'm sure we'll get there. It's, the para archery team in Australia is incredible. So the nationals that just went past, I believe I had someone that came away with bronze, so that was incredible. That would be Patrick.

05:11 S2

What about Paris and how well, how'd you go and how'd you think you went? And how was the whole experience?

05:17 S1

Oh, it was incredible. The village was a safe place. You know, having all the different athletes, different sports. And it was just... there's no words for it. It was an incredible place to be. Everything was catered for and factored in. Everyone was, all the athletes were well looked after. And just when I went there, I guess I was honed in on focusing on archery. And it's the same athletes that we compete with when we go to world championships and across the board for the most part, and it was great to see them, and I just stayed in my own lane, if you will, until I finished my competition.

05:51 S2

And your competition went okay. You went in the singles, then you also teamed up with John Milner as well.

05:57 S1

Yes, I did, so I made it to the second round in The Individuals and with John and the mixed teams, we made it to the quarterfinals.

06:05 S2

Were you happy with that? I guess, you know, being an athlete, you're probably a perfectionist and you always want to do better. But you know, this is the world's best that you're competing against.

06:14 S1

Absolutely. And, you know, ideally we would have liked to have done a little bit further. But at that level it's anyone's game. You know it's best on the day and anything can happen. And Jonathan Milne mentioned once, dropping names, you know you can have ten athletes at that level, ten different competitions and you will have a different outcome every time. You'll never have the same outcome. So it's just on the day and you know, you give it your all and yeah, we'll be back.

06:40 S2

That puts it into a great perspective Ameera. I know we've spoken in the past, but you do have MS. I guess managing that is kind of a full time job, if you will.

06:51 S1

It is. I sometimes refer to my arms as my temper tantruming toddler. So am I not so good days, I say I love my MS is having a temper tantrum again. You know, I just I just deal with it. It is what it is. But, you know, in the heat, that type of thing. There's ice packs. You know, you can have spasticity. And this is what I trained for. Over the years, I learned how to train around... issues with my arms or whatever may have you, and you just work around it. You just be creative and just find a way.

07:23 S2

In a way, the longer you live with it, the easier it is. But I guess the more you kind of get to know yourself and know the condition.

07:31 S1

Oh, absolutely. And and the same when I'm on, when I'm, I guess when I'm on the line and, I'm in terms of MS, I can be different every hour or so. It's very unpredictable. So the hours that we put into practice for me, four days a week, as well as two days in the gym, I keep pushing myself to work around if if my right hand is not functioning properly or my left arm. I know how to work around it and you just run with it in the moment.

08:00 S2

I know one of the things that we've spoken to people about with EMRs, it's kind of such a balancing act, because when you're feeling really good, you want to do so much. And of course, if you do too much, then you're not going to feel too good for a little while after that. So as I said, it's such a fine line.

08:16 S1

Absolutely. And I'm terrible in terms of that. I have the moments where I'm feeling great, everything's good. I'm going to fit in as much as I can and then stuff the repercussions for a few days after it. But, it's like I have moments where everything is fantastic. It's not to say I don't have a symptom, but it's at the best it could be for that day. And that's it. I'm getting done as much as I can get done and... forget that. So my temper tantrum and my temper tantrums I miss will remind me very quickly the next day.

08:47 S2

I know there's a few athletes that compete with them. Is there much research that goes on in that area? Kind of. Specifically for elite athletes and how to best manage their MS. I know there's obviously a lot of work for the mere mortals of the world that might have MS, I'm talking about maybe the not elite athletes, but what about in that elite athlete area?

09:06 S1

I guess in terms of elite athletes, we have the physiotherapists, the doctors, etc. strength and conditioning coaches available. I guess in terms of elite athletes, they're more it's more specified to the individual and more specific to the individual. And as you might be aware, Peter, everyone that has MS is very different. So it's the same thing that athletes as well. So it depends on the sports and and how the in particular the MS impacts on their performance and how their day to day, I guess living with MS.

09:39 S2

Yeah, that's certainly a fascinating topic. And I'm sure as you say, there can be a lot of research goes on. But because it's such an individual thing that sort of... you know, complicates things a bit more, or it's a bit more complex.

09:51 S1

Absolutely.

09:53 S2

I mean, I know when we spoke last time, you talked about your son getting you into archery because you took him along to play the sport, and you fell in love with it. Was your son able to get to Paris to watch you compete? 

10:07 S1

No, he stayed behind. He's in year ten. So it's the end of year ten, and, you know, you're getting everything ready for year 11 and all. Yeah. So that was kind of an optimal time to stay. He watched it on television. So you know going forward hopefully going for the US and everything goes well. And he might be able to come with me, but... we're just prioritising. 

S2

OK. Well I guess, well, I was going to say your mother doesn't compete at the Paralympics every day, but maybe you might be competing a few more times, so maybe there will be other occasions. But that must be a very special bond, though. And I guess in a sense that, you know, so I think that gratitude of debt for or a debt of gratitude, I should say, for getting you into the sport. 

10:49 S1

Absolutely. And, you know, one of the things that he enjoys, we had... the New South Wales Institute of Sports awards night. It's his favourite night and they hold them every few years. And, uh, that's my way of saying thank you. So I take him to these awards nights, you know everything. It's not about me. And I said it the first time he went a few years ago... that evening was not about me. It's about him and enjoying the moment, meeting other athletes and and me saying thank you. Because remember, the families as well are sacrificing, you know, the athletes are sacrificing time with their families, uh, and everything that works around it. 

And so my son is definitely, you know, I'm, I wouldn't be... he's been so amazing and, you know, and I have to go training. Sometimes he'll come and stay with my training and do homework... but he'll be around. But now he's more so at home. But he's just been fantastic.

11:40 S2

Is that getting along to an awards night? Kind of getting to meet face to face some of his other heroes apart from his mum.

11:47 S1

Yeah, he gets the institutes, but the awards night, he always gets to meet people. So he was quite starstruck the first time. But it's kind of like walk in the park now. It's so normal to him.

11:57 S2

Terrific. Well, it's a lovely way to put it. Ameera, I know you've got plenty on. Thank you so much for making the time. Congratulations to you and the entire archery team. It's quite a big team that went away, wasn't it, from Australia?

12:08 S1

It is. There was a big team. We had seven, but unfortunately one of the athletes had an injury. So we ended up going with six I believe. But yeah, no it was crazy. And... the team's just growing exponentially. And you know we're just hoping to get more archers as the years go past.

12:26 S2

Well I know we've spoken to a few of the athletes since you've been back and the coverage on Channel 9, I'm sure we'll be seeing the benefits of that will be seen in years to come, when more and more athletes are, you know, a good influence by what they saw and said, well, I want to be another Ameera Lee or, you know, I want to do track and field or whatever because of what they saw. So I'm sure those benefits will pay off for years to come. It's great to know. Going on, I was going to ask you if you're going to go on. It's great to know you're going on. So I look forward to the next time we speak. And thanks again for making some time for us today.

12:56 S1

Thank you so much. And thank you for having me, Peter.

12:58 S2

It's Ameera Lee there, not long back from Paris, competing in the sport of archery. 

Well, the squad has just been named for Australian blind cricketers to play England in the Blind Ashes. Oscar Stubbs is one of those players - so Oscar, great to meet you. Thanks for your time.

13:15 S3

Thanks, mate. No, glad to be here.

13:17 S2

Nice to be selected. It's a big event, isn't it? So of course, Covid interrupted things. So eight years we should have played in the Blind Ashes.

13:24 S3

Yeah. It's been a long time since we've played a Blind Ashes. It's a little bit annoying, but, you know, we're we're glad to have it coming up soon and can't wait to get out there and, you know, give it to those those England blokes.

13:37 S2

Yeah. It's a pretty tight schedule. You've got, a number of games in not many days, so you have to be right on your mettle.

13:44 S3

Yeah, lucky for us we've had a pretty good training resume coming up. I can speak for the New South Wales boys. There's about six of us going up there. And... we've been, you know, training really hard and going into the gym, going into the... batting and bowling aspects and the fielding. But yeah, we've been going real hard getting ready to go.

14:02 S2

And playing in... Queensland, around the Gold Coast.

14:05 S3

Yeah. We'll be up in the Gold Coast. I'm hearing it's it's getting quite hot, bit hot out there at the moment. Up at 34, 35 sometimes. So yeah. Got to be ready for those... wet and hard conditions.

14:17 S2

Nice greeting for the Englishman to come out and play in those sort of conditions. 

14:21 S3

Yeah, I think it'll be tough for them. I know coming from somewhere where it's quite cold normally... yeah. It'll be... a hard, hard challenge.

14:29 S2

Oscar, it's seven to eight years since we played the Blind Ashes there. You weren't playing blind cricket then? How'd you get into the game? 

14:35 S3

Yeah, so I wasn't playing back then, when they played the last Blind Ashes, I think that was 2015. They played down in Adelaide. I was actually still a part of able-bodied cricket. At the time I would have been 15 years old. I had the vision impairment since I was born. It's now called optic neuropathy, so I've had that since I was born. I was playing able-bodied cricket, mainstream cricket, till about 16. I heard from a friend about blind cricket and I thought, why not give it a go? I've... never heard of it before. Didn't even know we had... blind cricket available. I went out to my first training session and within the first month I was playing in my first NCIC for New South Wales.

15:21 S2

We'll talk about a couple of performances there in the second. What about that part of it, Oscar, you're 15, 16. Kind of... you know, wanted to be cool. Was it a bit of a tough thing to sort of, in a sense, admit that you had a vision impairment or to play blind cricket rather than conventional cricket, you know what I'm saying? Was it a little bit of a, you know, a bit of an admission that, OK, you know, I'm a little bit different from most other people in the sense?

15:45 S4

Yeah. It actually took me a little bit of time to, you know, come to terms with it as well, because I'd made a lot of friends during my time playing mainstream sport. And, you know, it may have been challenging and and it may have been hard, but at the end of the day, being able to come into a sport where I was valued the same as everybody else with the same sort of impairment or different impairment was something that I thought was was really good. And I am so happy with my decision to change from my mainstream sport to my blind sports, because the opportunities that we've been given and the the games and friendships that I've made have been, you know, second to none. And yeah, I would... I wouldn't change that decision for the world.

16:27 S2

Well said. What about adjusting to the actual game itself? You're playing conventional cricket now. Blind cricket. I mean cricket, but a little bit different in terms of technique and the sort of way the game is played. 

16:40 S3

Yeah. It was, it was quite funny to, to start actually. I mean, when I came in and I didn't have anything no idea what blind cricket was, to be honest, I didn't know how the game was played. I didn't know about the ball being different, anything like that. So when I first came in, these, these blokes were bowling underarm at me with plastic ball bearings inside. And I my first thought is to drive. I mean, everything in your normal cricket is your stand-up shots. But for us now it's, you're basically on one knee. Nearly every shot of the game. You get the conventional drive out of some other shots. But yeah, you're always down on one knee trying to play the sweep, reverse chop. So yeah, it took a little while to get used to that, but I think I've finally got the handle on it now.

17:23 S2

Okay. We'll come to a couple of your innings, I promise in a second. What about the bowling side of things and the fielding side of things? So is it kind of a bit more comfortable playing blind cricket than conventional cricket as far as bowling and fielding goes?

17:35 S3

Yeah, 100%. I think when I was playing mainstream cricket, it was it was quite difficult. I mean, I used to be the person that they'd kind of hide in the field, put at fine leg to fine leg, like, the ball's not going to come to you in a catching position very often. But for me now, I kind of get the field wherever I want really, which is which is really cool. I, I love fielding, I think it's actually my favorite part of the game because you're out there competing with everyone on the team. So being a part of that and being able to, you know, have a say in decisions and... be a part of the fielding is something that yeah, I love bowling. 

Yeah. Bowling. So coming from mainstream cricket I was an opening bowler. So having that change, you know, from bowling overarm to underarm was still, still quite weird to this day. Like, it just feels so... not normal to what I was used to, but... yeah, it was something to get used to. But at the moment it's... yeah, it's all I know now. I tend to run in with an underarm action now, and I don't think I've done an overarm action since. So yeah.

18:43 S2

I guess we'll be playing for ten years at a certain way. It is a bit of adjusting to make and trying to feel comfortable doing it the underarm way.

18:51 S3

Yeah for sure. I mean, and then obviously having to try and do that at a high level and compete with other states and other countries in that game... you want to get to the best level you can in that. So yeah, being able to change from overarm being quite okay at that to then underarm trying to get better is it was... yeah, a challenge, but a good one at that.

19:12 S2

Yeah. You are an opening bowler in conventional cricket. What sort of batsman were you especially compared to? What sort of batsman you are now, Oscar?

19:20 S3

Yeah, I probably I don't even know if I could have called myself a batsman back then. Whenever the opportunity was there that I didn't have the bat, I definitely took it. I didn't like batting. It was just a yeah, it was something that I struggled with for quite a long time. But... I think now, yeah, batting in... blind cricket, oh,  I'll bat anywhere - I love, I love going out there and batting for my team and, you know, getting runs on the board and stuff like that. No better feeling than... going out there and doing something well for your team. So yeah, I love going out there batting, bowling or fielding. Either way, just about.

19:54 S2

Tell us about a couple of your favorite innings, particularly for New South Wales.

19:57 S4

Yeah. So we've, I played for New South Wales for a couple of years now. We've won the past five championships. I can't really put a finger on my favourite innings. I think if I had to pick one.

20:11 S2

Oh come on, after... yes you can, yes you can.

20:13 S3

No I, yeah I think everyone normally goes for, you know, the... hundreds or the 50s or anything like that. But I think for me there was one innings in my first NCI season that I played and it was a semi-final against Queensland, and I think it was somewhere up near 30, 35, 36 degrees on the day. And myself and my captain at the time, Lindsay Evans, went out to bat and I think we put on a partnership of none for 235 or something like that. And yeah, that was for one of my first years of playing to be able to do something like that and break a record at the time was something that, like it was really cool.

20:52 S2

So just just a quiet day at the office?

20:54 S3

Yeah, it was. Yeah, it was - I mean, it was... yeah, it was tough. So tough. But yeah, really cool to do that. And one of my first... NCI series.

21:02 S2

Yeah. We mentioned a pretty compact format. Uh, tell us about it. So it got T20s and... one day internationals... during the series. Yeah.

21:11 S3

So we got a couple of T20s.

21:13 S2

Yeah. Sorry.

21:14 S3

Couple of T20s, couple one dayers. Up there against England where, you know, we have a, we don't get to play too many one dayers in our format. I mean I've played for what, seven years now? And the only time I've played a one dayers have got one against New Zealand two years ago, I think it was now. So to play a 40-40 match will be, it'll be a very cool experience, but one that I'll definitely... be learning in while we're doing it. Because you want to... get to the best level that you can early on. 

21:44 S2

It's a great point. I mean, you know, they are kind of different matches, aren't they? I guess different... tempo. And your approach to the game is going to be a bit different as well, because 40 overs, you've got to be out there a bit longer than... a swashbuckling 20 over match.

21:56 S3

Yeah, there's definitely a cricket for me. I think it's definitely a, it's a mental sport. I mean, you're going to go out there, it's going to be hot, it's going to be a long day. So you really got to get into that mental side and, you know, push hard and get through all the overs. I mean, at the end of the day, if you're an opening batter and you go out there to field and then you go out to the bat, you're not playing just a 40 over game, you're almost playing 80 overs if you stay in there long enough. So yeah, just to put yourself through that grueling conditions and bat for that long will be will be pretty tough. Hopefully we can do that. But... yeah, looking forward to it nonetheless.

22:29 S2

I guess you don't know a lot about the English team... or do you?

22:32 S3

So we played them last year in a one off game, up at the International Blind Games over in Birmingham. So we got to play one game against them. I mean, take it as it is, we played the one game, I can't remember too much about the boys. All I remember is, you know, getting to meet them afterwards and before and hanging out with them in the village. And, you know, all those guys are really nice blokes and keen to meet up with them again when they come down here. But once we get on the field, it's a different ball game. So once we step over the white line we'll take it to them.

23:03 S2

There's nothing like beating a, not a team of nice blokes, is it. Nothing like it.

23:07 S3

Oh yeah. Yeah, 100%, 100%. They got the wood over us over there. So you know, we really want to get them back when they come down here. So yeah, we'll take it to them.

23:17 S2

Wish you well, Oscar. I'd love to get a special shout out to Aaron Lol - I'm not sure if you know, but I see that he's made the squad for the first time. He's one of the really nice people involved with Will, involved with sport and music and massage therapists. We spoke to Aaron a few times over the years. He's a very decent human being, so, so pleased that Aaron's made the squad for the first time. Yeah.

23:38 S3

No. Aaron's, Aaron's a lovely guy. We actually roomed at our last our last camp that we had. And, yeah. Funny story about Aaron. Funny story for him. Not so much for me, but we played a New South Wales versus South Australia final for the MCI season a couple of years ago. I think it might have been my second or third one. And we, I went out there to open the batting. I was at the non-striker's end. Lindsay Evans, who I was speaking about before, hit the ball straight back to the bowler on the second ball. And I've started running thinking it's gone past him. And Aaron ran me out for a diamond duck. So Aaron's definitely got the wood over me when it comes to cricket at the moment. 

But, yeah, he's a lovely bloke and he deserves every opportunity that he has been given to him, so I can't wait to see him bow when we get over there and you know he's going to go really well. 

24:24 S2

He's a lovely bloke... but he didn't call you back!

24:25 S3

No, no, no, he was happy to get rid of me that day. Don't worry. Luckily, luckily enough, we got the win that day. But yeah, he definitely got the win over me in that sense. 

24:34 S2

Well, it's great to catch up with you. Good luck to you and the boys. We'll keep in touch as the next couple of weeks. The 17th of November is when the series gets underway, so we wish you and the rest of the team well. And so we'll keep in touch with the scores and keep our listeners across it all. 

24:48 S3

No, easy. Thanks, guys. No. Really, really happy to be here.

24:50 S2

That's Oscar Stubbs, one of the members of the Australian blind cricket team, as they prepare to play against England for the Blind Ashes. You're in elite company listening to Leisure Link here on Vision Australia Radio, VA radio, digital VA radio, dot org and through the TuneIn radio app. 

Always lots of fun things happening at Tutti, or it's a chance for you to also get involved. Let's catch up with a couple of stars that are friends of the show. Annika. Nicko, how are you going?

25:24 S4

I'm good, thank you.

25:25 S2

I always say our most famous export. And also Aimee Crathern. How are you Aimee? 

25:30 S5

Hi, I'm very well, thank you.

25:32 S2

Good to have you back with us. And for the first time, Bree, g'day Bree.

25:36 S6

Oh, hello. Thanks for having me.

25:39 S2

It's a pleasure. Well, we'll start with you first. You're the newest one. Tell us a bit about your involvement. How did you get involved with Tutti?

25:45 S6

Oh, well, I actually work here as a support worker, so I've gotten to know Tutti over the past year. Everyone that works here and is an artist. And it's the most life changing place ever.

26:00 S2

And so it wasn't hard to get involved.

26:02 S6

Oh, not at all. It was like just the most beautiful people, you know, all encouraging and supportive. And I felt very at home. And yeah, the choir particularly, you know, such a lovely choir.

26:17 S2

The beautiful people. Does that include present company as well? I mean Anika? 

26:21 S6

Yes! Yes, of course it does.

26:23 S2

I just thought I'd ask just to clarify.

26:25 S6

Yeah.

26:27 S2

How are things going? How's your year been? First of all, you've had a pretty busy year with stuff happening at uni.

26:32 S6

Yes I have. 

26:34 S2

Tell us about some of the things you've been doing.

26:35 S6

This year we went and performed the Sisters of Invention, when? And performed their... cabaret show... you ready for this? ... at the Perth International Cabaret Festival, which went very well. Which went really well. So yes, we did... two shows of that in Perth. Yeah.

26:54 S2

I mean, what's it like when you go away to a sort of a, you know, a different place, a different venue? What's that like, that kind of acclimatising and adjusting?

27:02 S5

It's just about the injustice to the time and where you are. Some people find it very scary being away from home for a while and some people enjoy it. So I think it's just about adjusting to what's going on outside as well, when you're somewhere different. Yeah, yeah. It's, it was fun. I enjoyed my time. It was just nice to be able to go away for a little bit as well.

27:34 S2

You've both done a fair bit of travel though, haven't you? 

27:37 S5

Yes we have, yeah we have over the years. We have. Yes.

27:40 S2

Tell us about some of the places you've been to, Annika.

27:42 S4

I've been to... the Denmark Festival of Voice, Denmark, Western Australia... I've...

27:52 S2

Yeah, you nearly had us there. We thought Denmark, that's pretty cool!

27:55 S4

But... not Denmark.

27:57 S2

And Western Australia is pretty cool too, as well.

27:59 S4

I'm sure I had to be specific. Yeah. Yeah. I've been to their,,, Festival of Voice there and performed and yeah, I've actually been twice. The first time was with 2D, and with 2D and the Sisters of Invention. And then the following year I went with Philip Griffin and did the Denmark Festival of Voice.

28:22 S2

Fantastic. What about you, Aimee? Tell us about some of your travels apart from Perth. And you've toured a bit of Adelaide as well. What about some of the other places you've been?

28:30 S5

Well, I went to Alice Springs. Oh yes, we did shows up in Alice Springs. The Sisters did a few shows in Alice Springs. I've travelled to America twice.

28:45 S2

Oh, really?

28:46 S5

Yeah.

28:47 S2

I know.

28:48 S5

I have, and I've been a lot of places with 2D and and other things, so yeah, we've both travelled a lot, actually.

28:57 S2

Rather than the Sisters of Invention, you could be the Leyland Sisters. Do you guys know the Leyland Brothers or is that before your time?

29:04 S5

No, I don't even know them.

29:06 S2

Oh, no, you're making me feel old. Anyway, check it out on YouTube. The Leyland Brothers, Mike and Mo, they used to travel around Australia... kind of,  yeah, that was kind of cool. I reckon you'd like the song too. In fact, I reckon maybe you should think about putting the song on your playlist. Anyway, that's enough about that, Bree. Tell us about what you've got coming up and how people can get involved with this.

29:29 S6

Alright, well, I might leave it to Annika and Aimee, actually. 

29:33 S2

OK. Yeah, you're a bit shy, Bree.

29:36 S6

Well, you know, these ladies are singing in the choir.

29:39 S2

No, no, no, just. Alright. What? Alright, well, you're pretty good with dates and times. What have you got coming up?

29:46 S4

So we've got the Tutti Takeover concert. Yeah. And... tickets for that are selling fast. So if we sell out for the first show, we we may release more tickets for a second. Okay, so, yeah, the first show is at 2:15 p.m. on the 17th of November, which is a Sunday. Yes. On a Sunday. And it's at the Acca Bar, not Acca Bar, the Uni Bar. Yep.

30:15 S2

And in your bar, you're getting your bath mixed up there.

30:18 S4

Hang on. No it's not, it's Uni. It's the....

30:21 S2

Uni. That's all right.

30:23 S4

Yeah.

30:24 S2

I mean, can you can you let us in on what might be on the playlist?

30:28 S5

Oh, absolutely. I can I can let you in. We're doing Love Shack and, yes, doing Love Shack. We've got the Rainbow Connection. We've got a little bit of, oh, Justin Timberlake. Oh, yeah. We've got Tina Turner. We've got a lot of songs, actually.

30:55 S2

So people are kind of... I mean, apart from being able to hear you, they'll kind of be able to join in as well.

30:59 S5

Yeah, absolutely.

31:01 S4

So there's something for everybody. Yep.

31:03 S2

Yeah. Because it's something that people will know.

31:05 S4

Yes.

31:05 S2

Mhm. How long have you been in rehearsal for, Annika?

31:09 S4

Oh, for this. Oh yes. For this show. We've been in rehearsal for quite a while. Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah... well, probably a couple of months.

31:22 S2

Have you played at a uni bar before?

31:24 S4

No.

31:24 S7

This will be our first.

31:25 S4

This will be our first time at the uni bar.

31:28 S2

Does that I mean, in terms of, I guess, orientating yourself. And for those people that might know you have a vision impairment. So kind of to kind of... orientate yourself, is that a bit of an issue when you go to a new place or how do you do that? Do you go there first and kind of... have it explained to you, or do you walk around?

31:45 S4

I'll have it explained to me, like when we actually go there to do it. Yep.

31:50 S5

And the tickets are concession, is $17 cheap? Yeah. 17.

31:56 S2

No, actually not cheap. Inexpensive? Cheap makes it sound nasty, but Inexpensive - good value. Value for money.

32:02 S5

Yep. Seated seats are $28 and standing is 22. Companion card. Accept it. Beautiful. Oh, yeah. And it's wheelchair accessible. And the kitchen and the bar will be open for drinks and light food.

32:16 S2

So good food. Good music. Yeah. Good. Good venue. Yeah. What what what could you want for more than that?

32:24 S5

Well, you get good people.

32:26 S2

Yeah, exactly. Yeah. That's fantastic. Um.

32:29 S5

Oh, good.

32:30 S2

Can you let us into anything for next year at this stage, or is it all top secret next year?

32:36 S6

Top secret.

32:38 S2

Ranger?

32:39 S6

Exciting stuff though.

32:41 S4

Then we do have exciting stuff coming up.

32:44 S5

Uh, yeah. Yeah.

32:45 S2

So what they've got to do is they've got to stay tuned to this radio program to to hear whenever it's announced, don't they? That's the kind of way you do it.

32:52 S5

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.

32:54 S1

Exactly.

32:55 S5

But please come and enjoy our music.

32:57 S2

Well, yeah. Well, that's one thing at a time. That's a good message, actually. Yeah. Let's get to the takeover at uni bar first so they could give us the details again and hopefully it'll sell out because, I mean, it's not for the first time you do put a show on more than once because it's very, very popular. Yeah.

33:13 S5

Yeah, it's on the 17th of November, Sunday, the 17th of November at 2:15 p.m. at the Uni Bar.

33:22 S2

And I mean, tickets are selling fast.

33:25 S5

Absolutely. Tickets are selling fast. So I would suggest you go on the website and.

33:33 S2

Georg.org.

33:35 S5

And you will find that there is a barcode. Barcode? Yeah. A barcode that you just click on and you can get your tickets from there.

33:46 S2

I mean, when you finish your music career or perhaps alongside your music career, maybe you can do marketing and promotion. Oh, that's, that sounded very, very professional. Yeah.

33:56 S5

Well, thank you very much, I practice. 

33:59 S2

Oh, did you? Well, I tell you what. keep practicing because there'll be someone out there looking for a marketing PR person. And Aimee Crathern is the lady's name that we're speaking to. So get in touch with me. I'll be her manager, and then we can all make a fortune.

34:13 S5

Oh, that will be fantastic, Peter.

34:15 S2

Yes. Great. Good to meet you. Yeah, the the sort of quiet one in the corner, but doing all the work. So thank you for arranging these lovely ladies. And it's always great to catch up with you. I've got to say, our most famous export. And also Aimee Crathern, one of our great friends of the show. Good to catch up with you guys. Yes.

34:34 S5

Thank you so much.

34:42 S2

Time to catch up with our illustrious physiotherapist from the Flipper Academy, Chelsea Marchetti. Hello, Chelsea.

34:49 S7

Hello, Peter. How are you?

34:50 S2

I'm going especially well. Now, you're talking about a really important topic. And I guess it's important in terms of prevention rather than how we recover from the fall?

35:00 S7

Yeah, absolutely. Prevention is really, really important when it comes to falls, and a massive part of what we do in physiotherapy. So really, really excited to talk about this one today.

35:11 S2

And I guess maybe even more important for older people, do you think?

35:14 S7

We usually target our over 65 age group when it comes to falls prevention - but in saying that, there are lots of other demographics such as disability, that we also try and help with falls and prevention of falls, especially sometimes our pediatric population as well. There are lots of little kiddos that can be at risk of falls or frequently fall a lot. So we do do a bit of work around that... but when we're talking about a lot of falling prevention, we mainly look at the over 65 age group because they're the ones that often will have the biggest repercussions from a fall. So we want to try and prevent that as much as we can.

35:50 S2

And I guess that's one of the things, isn't it? The the sort of prevention is worth much more than the cure or the efforts that go into the cure. I guess you can do all sorts of things when you're recovering, but if you can prevent it, then those sort of things you can kind of avoid.

36:03 S7

Absolutely. And they can be really severe as well, the repercussions of falling. So we really want to try and prevent it as best we can, put in some things in place that can make us avoid having a fall or being at risk of a fall as well.

36:18 S2

What sort of things should we be thinking about? 

36:20 S7

So we often like to think about the practical things around the home as a start. So trying to avoid climbing on unsteady objects and reaching up on that awkward ladder to try and turn the light off, or anything where there's an uneven pavement outside. So there's some really practical, I guess, home around the house type things that we can look for to try and avoid falling within the home. And then there's other things that we can look at as well, that are more about our balance and how we can be better on our feet. So they're probably more the things that a physio would look at. And then an occupational therapist would be the person that would be likely to look at the home setup and the best way to avoid falls within the home setup.

37:01 S2

Now, I know you're a physiotherapist, not a psychologist, but it's kind of part of the problem. You talked about people maybe doing stuff on unsteady surfaces, etc. is part of the problem or part of the issue. In a sense, the fact that because we're at home and we kind of think we know our own home, we maybe get a bit too comfortable, a bit too complacent? 

37:20 S7

Absolutely. I think, you know, we've been climbing that same, yeah, very unsteady step to the,,, dust that light off for the last ten, 15 years, that we forget that as we do get older, our balance can be a little bit different. We're not as strong or you know, that generally can happen. So we forget about those things. We know we've done it a million times. It's usually that a-million-and-first time that caused the fall, unfortunately.

37:44 S2

And I guess it's the sort of thing where... you know, if you're not, you know, on your game the whole time, if you're distracted, if the phone rings or you, you know, get a message or you know, you're thinking about something else rather than what you're doing, that can be a bit of an issue as well.

38:00 S7

Absolutely. We talk a lot about when we're learning falls prevention and we're doing exercises for falls prevention. We talk about a cognitive overload. So it's really great to do standing on one leg or standing feet together, standing feet apart and practicing our balance. But in the likelihood of falls type scenario, you're often thinking about more than one thing. You're not necessarily just thinking about where your feet are. So we try and do some exercises in physio where we talk about, Tell me your favorite colour or Talk to me about your day while you're standing on one leg or something like that, where we're using our cognitive ability as well, because that often will be the reason why we'll fall, because we won't be thinking about where our feet are while we're doing something. 

So trying to combine those two things together is a really great way to help teach our brain to be in tune with our body.

38:48 S2

Okay. How cool is that? I've never heard of that. I mean, of course I've heard about standing on one leg, for example. But the kind of combination of the cognitive part of things as well. Or, you know, what's your favorite colour is you're trying to stand on one leg. That's very innovative.

39:02 S7

Yeah, yeah, we do it a lot with our kiddos, because we often find kids are the ones that, they fall a lot because they're thinking about a million things at once. You know, they want to run to the playground, forgetting that there's a really uneven surface between where they are in the playground and they fall over, or they need to put their pants on. And while you put your pants on, you've got to stand on one leg. So if you're not thinking about two things at once, more often than not, that can lead to a bit of a fall. So that is a really easy way to progress. An exercise that we often do in physio is we'll add a cognitive overload to try and make it more of a real-world scenario for people.

39:36 S2

Fascinating. So the standing on one leg, I mean, is that a pretty good kind of starting point in terms of, does that help with balance or help with muscle strength? What's the kind of theory behind the standing on one leg practice? Well, I think.

39:48 S9

Well, I think... standing on one leg is really important across the board for many activities that we do. So think about running and hopping and getting dressed and putting your pants on, putting your shoes on. Do often going up steps. We do often do single leg stuff a lot, so it is really good for muscle strength and balance. I'd be cautious to say to depending on what demographic we're advising. So we'll do it a lot with little kids because often we can be in a pretty safe environment with them where there's lots of... pillows and soft areas around and all the water that if they fall, they're kind of in the pool with our over 65 seconds. That's not often where we'll start, because that's not necessarily where there would be in the normative values for the demographic. 

We usually start with something like standing with feet together and having their eyes open, and then we might progress that and make them close their eyes, and we might get them to put one foot in front of the other. So we're narrowing their base of support, which is increasing how much they need to balance their body. And when we take their vision away. That actually makes it even more difficult, because we have to rely on other parts of our body to try and balance. Which, yeah, is also a really interesting thing when we heavily rely on vision. That can be a bit of a factor if we're not looking at where we're going and those sorts of things.

41:04 S2

And that's the sort of thing that probably people would take for granted. If you're using your vision, you're kind of not even aware of the fact that it's kind of... you know, playing a role as far as being more balanced goes.

41:13 S7

Absolutely. Yeah. For sure. And... you know, I have I'm sure he won't mind me talking about it, but I have a grandfather who... is having a few vision problems at the moment, and he's kind of said to me, Oh, I feel like I'm a bit off balance all the time. And I said to him, Well, you know, that can often happen because we need to use three areas of our body for balance our vision, our vestibular system, so our inner ear and... what we call our proprioception, which are these little receptors in our joints that tell us where we are in space. So when we don't have when one is more dominant than the other two, that can often be... not that great because then we're not evening out what we need. 

And when that one is vision, when things happen, like we lose our vision or our vision deteriorates, or we're not necessarily able to use our vision because we're focusing on other things and not looking where we're going, those other two areas become the higher dominancy. So if you don't have those in good strength, that can often make you at higher risk of falls as well.

42:08 S2

Yeah, that makes perfect sense. And of course, you know, we know on programs like this that the over 65 are highly represented as far as things like macular degeneration or maybe might have cataracts, that sort of thing, even glaucoma. So they're the sort of issues that impact on people's sight just by virtue of the fact that you are aging, particularly if they're not attended to the way they should be. 

S7

Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. 

S2

Okay. Just explain a little bit more about... so feet together, feet apart and also putting... foot forward. What's the kind of theory behind that, or what's... the practicalities of that?

42:41 S7

So when we think about the way we stand often. The way we normally stand would be our feet are underneath our shoulders. They're about hip-width apart, and that's what we call a base of support. So that's how we know that we're stable. Some people if you, if people generally can't walk without assistance, so you might need a frame that increases our base of support because you think about a frame is going to have more things on the exterior of you. So to improve our balance, when we think about if you're walking down a narrow alleyway, if we have to place one foot in front of the other or have our feet closer together, we're narrowing our base of support, which means we can't use our feet and our legs as much. To keep our balance. We have to use our hips and our tummy a bit more. 

So that's why we look at those sorts of exercises, because we try and use different, what we call balanced strategies to maintain our balance. So that's like, you know, when you might put your feet together or you're trying to balance your body kind of moves in different directions to try and keep its balance. More often than not, that's kind of what we're trying to train. A lot of people don't have those mechanisms. They'll just need to step or they'll just fall over. So trying to teach those mechanisms of balance, strategies to counterbalance yourself when you've got narrower bases of support can be really helpful in terms of regaining your balance if you do kind of lose a little bit, but also to help have better balance when you're walking through narrow passages or needing to have a narrower base of support in the community. Essentially even things like in a big crowd of people, like you've got to kind of manoeuvre through if you're kind of not... able to stand with your feet together. That can be quite a tricky task if you need a wider base of support.

44:19 S2

That is so well explained. And I guess, like as you're explaining it, I'm kind of thinking, well, of course, but until it's explained, it's kind of the sort of thing that maybe you don't think about.

44:28 S7

Yeah, absolutely. It's definitely something that, once the theory makes a lot of sense, but if you're looking at it from a distance, like, why are you practicing standing with your feet together? And you'll find a lot of the time, people who have walking aids get taught that a lot because they're so used to having a wider base of support. So when we're trying to teach them to... reduce how much they need of their walking aid or just trying to work on their balance in general, that's one that we'll do, because for them, that might be like standing on one leg for someone else. So it's different variations of people's balance that we can target through our exercises. 

44:59 S2

Now, of course, you're talking from a physiotherapist point of view, I guess, when it comes to people's quote unquote plans, if you like, you would probably consult with people like OTS as well to kind of get the best picture and the biggest picture of, you know, someone's environment to make it as safe as it can be.

45:14 S7

Absolutely. And I think it's a really fine balance as well between not taking someone's independence. Yeah, but also being able to keep them safe. So working with OT on the correct modifications to make people safe without taking away their independence is really, really important. That's something that we do together as a team, and we do it in both pediatric and the elderly community as well, because we want people to try and be as independent as they can whilst maintaining a really safe environment.

45:41 S2

It's been brilliant. Now, how are things going at the academy? We're sort of into November now, so... the weather's getting a bit warmer, so maybe a bit easier to get into the water. How are you going with your... services? Still spreading out across the state? 

45:57 S7

Well, we use the metropolitan area. Yeah, we're still spread all over the area. We've actually, Peter, introduced our school holiday program that we're going to do in late January, on Friday, on the last two Fridays of the school holidays. So Friday the 17th and Friday the 24th. We're going to run just what we're going to call Flipper Fun. So we're going to have kids just come five kids in each class. We've divvied them up into levels and things. I'll run it myself. And we're just going to have a bit of fun with kids in their swimming and their therapy and just let them have a bit more of a social environment for them during the holiday period. 

Nice and hot as you said. So really great way to get your kids involved. Really great way to talk to me if you're interested in your child being involved and it's just really good fun. So give us a call or you can contact us via email at inquiries at academy.com. So if you're interested in that one.

46:47 S2

Fun. Sounds like fun.

46:48 S7

Yeah, it should be really, really good. Very very excited.

46:51 S2

Chelsea, that was wonderful. Thank you so much. We'll catch up next month. 

46:54 S7

No worries at all. Thank you so much Peter. Have a great day.

46:56 S2

Chelsea Marchetti there, the person behind the Flipper Academy. And what's excellent information regarding falls and falls prevention. I'm sure we've all learned lots, and hopefully we can all kind of put it into practice.

47:10 S8

Hi, I'm Melissa Perrine, four time Winter Paralympian, bronze medalist and co-captain, and you're listening to Leisure Link with Peter Greco on the Vision Australia Radio network.

47:26 S9

Come on in.

47:28 S10

We open our doors to people we trust and care about, and for over 85 years, South Australians have been opening their doors to Resthaven. In turn, we've been opening doors to an easier, better life at home. From personal care to help with the shopping and social outings, you'll welcome the care that Resthaven brings.

47:49 S2

Trying to catch up with our wonderful supporters from Resthaven. And tonight we're going to catch up with Matt Craig, who's the operations manager for Retirement Living. Good to catch up.

47:58 S11

Matt, good to catch up with you too again, Peter.

48:00 S2

There were some big changes. There are some great changes happening at the moment, some exciting changes.

48:05 S11

Yeah. No, no, we've had a busy week this week. As of Monday the 4th, we've transitioned 799 properties across from a recent acquisition. So we've acquired properties from historically Aveo in South Australia into the Resthaven family. So it has been a busy week but a good week. So we've now we we originally had 409 properties and we were developing 11 down at Clifton, which I think we. Talked about last time on this show... and now we're up to... what's that? 1200.

48:45 S2

We've more than doubled, haven't you. Well, well over doubled. 

48:48 S11

Yeah, we've tripled. Tripled. We've tripled. So yeah. So everything's good. Happy days. It's just been a busy week. Yeah, yeah. But we've got... this gives us a really good critical mass in this space, and it allows great opportunity for resthaven.

49:03 S2

What about geographically, where are these 799 new ones? 

49:07 S11

Yeah, yeah. So we, our spend historically was from... yeah, yeah, we historically were as far north as Salisbury and as far south as Clevedon at Port Elliot Way. So now, we've actually, we didn't have a lot of presence in the West, 330 odd that are in the western suburbs, which is great, anywhere from North Haven to Fulham, to Leisure Court, the Oaks at Henley Beach. So there's a range of properties that we didn't have any presence in the West. And then we've also supplemented that with some more properties in the north, another couple of hundred in the north as well, and then spatterings through the eastern suburbs and a little bit of south as well. So we've actually got a really balanced portfolio in there. But also it's great for the residents as well.

49:53 S2

I'm assuming the 799 new ones have probably got people in them. But I guess the nature of retirement villages, there's a (quote unquote) turnover as we kind of go along.

50:03 S11

Yeah. Yeah. Turnover. We generally in the industry, you know, a 5 to 10% turnover of residents is kind of normal. So at the moment we've got about 20 vacancies in the legacy Resthaven stock and about 40 to 50 within the stock we've acquired. So great opportunity to make contact with us and reach out. We've got a place for you to accommodate anywhere from a one bedroom... [?Rachel] brought three to a three bedroom luxury apartment.

50:32 S2

You talked about expanding out into the western areas. I guess it's like the old adage, isn't it? There's one not too far from where you live. And I think we've chatted about this before to you and others, people, obviously, you know, for something like a retirement village would ideally like to stay in the area that they've grown up with or, you know, the last 20 or 30 or however many years they've lived there. So to have that, as you said, that well balanced spread of suburbs, it's got to be a good thing.

50:58 S11

Yeah, 100%. And already we're getting a lot of inquiries since the transition from those people we haven't met that were previously... on the waiting list with Aveo. And now they've come across to our waiting list and yeah, they're locals in the area. They're at North Haven, they're at Fulham Gardens. And just relax and retire in a restful environment and a, great community centres as well within these villages.

51:24 S2

Can people kind of, if you like, come off the street, Matt, or might it be people that are, to say receiving community services from Resthaven so they kind of know you, you know them, and maybe their next phase of their life is a retirement village type setup? How does that kind of work? You can sort of, as I say, someone just come off the street and say, I've heard about this or I've seen this development in your sort of portfolio. Can we have a bit of a closer look?

51:50 S11

Yeah, 100%. So people, we're already getting people that have obviously seen signage change or, you know, have heard about it on the grapevine and they're already reaching out to us. So we have a very robust way of doing list. Historically, Resthaven had circa 450 odd people on the waiting list. And now that's, you know, naturally increased dramatically with this acquisition. And so we we regularly will contact the waiting list with vacancies, but there will quite often be a situation where somebody literally walks off the street and says, I'm after a one bedroom at Marion, and they're accommodated within a couple of weeks because that suits them. There's no one else interested in that property as an example. 

So I just want to encourage people that are out in the community, come on board. We really make sure we keep in touch with our waiting list and make sure they're well informed, so we will be able to accommodate you in due course. 

52:37 S2

Okay. I guess that's a big waiting list. Kind of speaks to the volume of how important, how popular something like this is. And, you know, hence the decision to undertake the purchase of these... new set of... units.

52:51 S11

Yeah. You know, definitely a, pre-Covid and going into a little bit of Covid, the occupancy in the villages was a bit lower than now. But at the moment the industry is booming. And all providers are the same. I think people are, you know, looking at their... life and their assets and... you know, where they want to be longer term. And they're divesting family homes and divesting bigger properties to downsize and get all the maintenance and services supported. So it's it's a great time to do it. And also the market's pretty buoyant at the moment the property market. So that's a great financial decision for people to make to, to to bank some money as well and then relax and enjoy stuff and spend that money on travel, which a lot of our residents get off interstate or overseas.

53:33 S2

That's a great point, isn't it? Yeah. With the property market being the way it is, you say you can probably, you know, financially do as well as well as lifestyle choice goes. And of course, you know, being an aging population, we hear about that. You know, the baby boomers sort of coming into that area of their lives. This is going to be an ongoing situation, isn't it? You've got a long list of... potential clients. 

53:59 S11

Yeah, 100%. And we're finding a lot of people that are coming in, like, they might have sold an asset for, like, a half a million dollars as an example, their family home. And then they buy something with us for, you know, circa $300,000. They've got that money to put into the bank and then use that for things that they want to do travel, get around Australia, get around the world. You know, I'm a bit envious, to be honest with you. I'd love to be doing that as well, but I've got a few years till I retire.

54:24 S2

I was going to say exactly that. Mate, you sound way too young to be thinking about that, actually. On a serious note, though, what's the kind of minimum age for a retirement living accommodation?

54:34 S11

Yeah, just on our website where our guide is 60 years plus. That's our kind of guide for... Resthaven and with our own stand beside which is... more of a lifestyle luxurious village, 55 plus is there because a lot of people will come into the village at that age. We're really open to applications. The legislation obviously is around 55 plus, and you have to be working part time. So... that's a right of getting into a village across South Australia, yeah. So it's broadly, I mean, the majority of our clients at the moment, to be frank, are in the kind of 70, you know, early 70s range, that have finished up work in their mid to late 60s and they're coming in.

55:17 S2

Well, it's, there's something to be thinking about, and I guess particularly if we can plan it and it turns out the way that we've planned it, it's going to make for a very happy time there. Matt, if people want to find out more, how can we find out? How can we get in touch? 

55:29 S11

Yeah. The best way to get in touch with us is, our website is the most informative area. So just go to Resthaven [?Arzano] and type in retirement living in the search engine there and that'll direct you to all of our team. 

55:43 S2

Matt, you've had a busy week. We appreciate you spending some time on a Saturday afternoon-evening with us. Good luck to you, and I'm sure it won't be too long before we speak again.

55:50 S11

Thanks, Peter. Have a good night.

55:51 S2

That's Matt Craig there, the operations manager for retirement living at Resthaven. All those details up with our show notes. On the Vision Australia Network through your favorite podcast service on 1197 AM in Adelaide, you're listening to Leisure Link. 

Renmark played host to world premiere of a movie, At the Mercy. It's written and also directed by John Decaux. And John's on the line. John, great to meet you. Thank you for your time.

56:27 S12

Thanks for having me, Peter.

56:28 S2

How did the premiere go? Really good.

56:30 S12

It was, we got a decent turnout and we got a really good response. I think it kind of struck a chord with people, which was exactly what it was meant to do.

56:38 S2

Now, you're director and you wrote the movie, and I guess, in a sense, you were going back to the hometown. You grew up in that area?

56:43 S12

Yeah, I grew up in Luxton, and so we filmed all the exterior parts of the film up there, which is great, and I spent a lot of time up there for work anyway. But yeah, it's always a, it's a beautiful part of the world. And I yeah, I'm really passionate about telling stories around regional communities now.

56:58 S2

I guess it's a beautiful part of the world. But the story, if you like, is told through obviously a lovely young lady, but it's kind of... a story concentrating on mental health. 

57:08 S15

Yeah. So the story mostly centres around a small family unit, a mother, father and daughter who are going through the millennial drought. And they're it really speaks about the plight of that period of time and how the mental health struggles and the financial struggles that people were going through in that period.

57:28 S2

That was quite a long period of time, wasn't it? Kind of people forecasting it was never going to rain again and the river was going to dry up. I mean, fairly drastic predictions. But I guess, you know, when you're hearing these sort of things and relying on the weather to earn a living, that that obviously would add to mental health strains?

57:44 S12

Definitely. And I think that's one of the things that I guess isn't as kind of comprehended by people that don't grow up in the country, is that so much of it's dependent on the weather, and you really it's out of your control. And I think that's where and also like the financial strain that has and like part of the film and I originally wrote it was mainly focused around the loss of livestock. But my dad and a few others made a really good comment when they read the script is like, it's really the financial toll that really pushes people over the edge. And that's yeah, the crux of the story. 

58:13 S2

And the reason for choosing it or choosing telling it through a 14 year old...

58:17 S12

Well, something I felt really passionate about is like most of the when you make a story that resonates with people, sometimes by making it one step removed from them can really help. But also it's not often that story is told from the perspective of the impact it has on kids. Like as a as a parent now, myself and a business owner, I do my best to not take my stress and work home. But there's only so much we can do as adults to kind of shield them from that, especially when things are like you're on the ropes pretty badly, like the family is in this film. 

And as a young person growing up in the country, you kind of grow up really pretty quickly. And, you kind of... the gap between [?L.A.] Mayor Bomber... Barry Bomber, Council made a really good point on the panel was like, you mature really quickly as a young person in a rural community, but there's a big gap before you finally get to that maturity age of 18. And so it's a kind of, it's an interesting perspective that hadn't been explored as much.

59:14 S2

And in a sense, a bit isolated as well from. I mean, I guess you're going to school and you got that sort of peer connection and we're talking, you know, 20 years ago or up to 20 years ago when perhaps, you know, the the internet wasn't as prolific as it might be now as well, a bit more isolated, if I can put it that way.

59:30 S12

Yeah. No, it's, exactly. But then it's also isolating in the sense of, like as a kid growing up in a country town, like everybody knows everybody's business. So, you know, you kind of are isolated from really speaking about how you feel with the concern that you people are going to misunderstand what you're saying or being judged, especially around self-harm and suicide. It's one of those topics that often gets avoided at all costs. And it's even worse in a kind of rural setting, because the moment you say something like... I'm not doing it, I'm not in a good place and I'm not sure if I want to be around anymore. Everybody kind of jumps to a conclusion that doesn't allow for an open dialogue around that. 

And I think that's really crucial to creating a conversation that normalises it in a way. So then when it does come up, people can talk to each other and not feel, not... yeah, not go into panic mode when somebody mentions it.

1:00:22 S2

That is such a great point, isn't it, John? Because I guess, you know, these sort of things maybe sometimes, ironically, we're kind of more comfortable talking about it to a total stranger rather than, as you say, someone who kind of knows all our business.

1:00:34 S12

Yeah, 100%. And I think that's where it's partly normalising that whole speaking to each other. But also we we've got the fortunate element of now with telehealth being so prominent after Covid, that we do have that option as country people, that once you go to your GP and you get your mental health plan, there's nothing stopping you from talking to a psychologist or talking to somebody outside of the area that you live in as much as anymore. And so that kind of has opened up a lot of doors to being able to get help externally of the region that you live in.

1:01:04 S2

A great point. Just a bit about Sunday. Then the movie was screened at premiere, but had a panel discussion as well, that kind of went around it.

1:01:12 S12

Yeah, which was great. And it was my my goal around that is the film hits on some really hard topics. All I have to self-harm, and I didn't want to destroy the audience out in the auditorium. So we had Tommy Allen, the mental health Commissioner, Brett McGill from accounting and Eleanor from the Berri Barmera Council on the panel. And we essentially had a really open dialogue around rural issues, around mental health, suicide and substance abuse. And it was really great and financial because that was, that's the other thing. Like the main like, financially as business owners, it's kind of easy to just stick your head in the sand and like, pretend like it'll be all right. Whereas the reality is you like knowing your numbers is a lot less scary than not knowing the numbers. 

And there's a lot of support out there through Centrelink and breaking down that shame around. Certainly there's a great program that Brett brought up which is Farmhouse Allowance, which helps farming families with vouchers or short term help, but also the long-term help with accounting fees and signing up for zero and doing learning, upskilling around accounting to maintain your books. So I think that it was really great to... have that open discussion with the community.

1:02:21 S2

This is something like that. You can maybe read a few... troubling signs or red flags if you like, before it's kind of gone too far. 

1:02:29 S12

Well, that's something that the commissioner made a really good point around suicide in a way, because 1 in 9 people at some point in their lives... yeah, consider it as an option. Not necessarily all the way to, like, I'm going to do something about this, but more like... I just wish I wasn't here as even like that's sort of the pathway there was normalising that, that everybody at some point most people had that at some point feel that and normalising the conversation around that has been shown to actually start to slow down the process of going spiralling. And I think that's the thing, like talking about it has never caused anybody to go and do anything to themselves. So that's where the worry around, Hey, we shouldn't talk about this because it might cause a problem... is actually part of the actual issue. 

1:03:12 S2

Yeah, that's another great point. John, what about as far as sort of politicians being representative to talk about local government, which is a great thing as well, because they can play a role, I guess, in terms of, you know, local members of Parliament or people in that area that come off the land. I mean, I guess, you know, the National Party, for example, has got a pretty big presence of, you know, people that are either off the land or representing people off the land.

1:03:34 S12

Yeah. Tim Whetstone was going to be there, but on the panel. But unfortunately, he was helping his daughter move to Sydney, so kind of didn't line up. But that's where I think something that the commissioner brought up that we should all petition, no matter what side of politics your local members are around, is that as a state of South Australia, we don't currently have a human rights law against being discriminated. If you seek mental health help or if you've considered. Have you got medical help for mental health? Currently, you can be discriminated by employers by legally. 

So something that we as a state should really look and focus on is putting human right laws around non-discrimination with mental health. I think that was a really interesting thing that I learned about last week from the commissioner. So I think if you can campaign your local members no matter what side of the aisle, because I know that they are they're like bipartisanly working of working through, trying to get something up in Parliament at the moment.

1:04:34 S2

Fantastic. And I know that you touched on Tim there, but I guess in a sense that's another quote unquote issue in a sense, you know, kids that maybe grow up and either don't want to be on the land or move to the city for employment opportunities, kind of another layer to the whole thing.

1:04:48 S12

Yeah. And I think that's where it's about creating a sense of safe space really as well, and wanting to come back later in life. And it's yeah, it's a tricky one. And as we get to the point of having like farm becoming consolidated and more corporate, it's become a real tricky thing to get people to stay back or come back.

1:05:09 S2

Because you've got to, you know, amalgamation of sporting clubs and less sporting clubs, less opportunities or that sort of stuff as well. And rural doctors say there's lots of things that go in the mix, John. The Premier was on the weekend in Renmark. What about for those of us that weren't able to get there, or hearing about it now and thinking that seems something that I would really like to get to get to see. How might that happen in the future, do you think? 

1:05:32 S12

Off the back of the screening we had about reached out to via an organisation like what? A prominent organisation that would be keen to take her on a regional tour. So hopefully at some point in the next couple of months or early next year, we'll be doing a regional tour with the film and having a similar panel discussion, which we really exciting. 

1:05:50 S2

Well, I think that'll be something well worth letting people know about. So we'll keep in touch with you on this, John. And certainly if when that happens, it'll be good to let the world know about it. That's the film At the Mercy. Great charter too, isn't it? The mercy, at the mercy of... well, everything almost, isn't it? 

1:06:07 S12

Yeah. At the mercy of the weather. At the mercy of... the uncontrollable nature of farming. 

1:06:13 S2

Yeah. Beautifully named John. And obviously, you know, this interview has raised issues with anyone. And you need support. Please contact an organisation like Lifeline on 13 1114 - 13 1114. John, great to meet you. Congratulations on the initiative. It's a story that obviously needs to be told. And, you know, art is such a powerful way to get the message across. So we wish you well on that, and we'll keep in touch and let people know when the movie gets to a greater, uh, reaches. And, who knows in the future, John, what this could lead to.

1:06:45 S12

Thanks, Peter.

1:06:46 S2

John Decaux there, the writer and also director for At the Mercy, which premiered in Renmark last weekend. 

We have some good news regarding the NDIS. Yes, the good news. Don't adjust your hearing. And it's perfectly what I am saying. The national award recently for a South Australian company. And to tell us more about it from Utopia Care, we've got Tony Smith. Tony, welcome and congratulations. 

S13

Yes. Thank you very much. 

S2

What's it like being recognised with a national award?

1:07:17 S13

Well, recently there's been a lot of negative reaction towards NDIS - and Utopia Care receiving this recognition is truly humbling and deeply meaningful, both personally and for our organisation, Utopia Care. It reflects our work, dedication and passion of everyone involved in our mission.

1:07:37 S2

Now you set up the company... what, about 12 or so years ago?

1:07:40 S13

No, I set it up on November the 15th, 2019. Okay, so it's only been going for just short of five... five years next week.

1:07:55 S2

Yeah. So it's the, their anniversary?

1:07:56 S13

Yes. So originally commenced in my small bedroom of my house. Then I went to the larger bedroom of the house. Then I converted the garage. Then I moved to the Morphett Vale in South Adelaide. Then I moved to Glenelg. Then we moved to, opened up another office in Glenelg. So we just keep getting bigger and bigger and bigger and now we're in the search of looking even a bigger premises. So the company's going very, very well at the moment, so I'm really pleased with that.

1:08:31 S2

I guess people are voting with their... plans, if you like, you do a good job. So they're coming to you and it's expanding. And you're actually in Brighton as well, I believe.

1:08:40 S13

Yes, yes, we've we've connected with the properties and... rental properties. And we're also hoping to go into aged care soon as well. So, that's another avenue. We work closely with a lot of Aboriginal elders up in that area, and some things we want to progress with.

1:09:02 S2

A bit of a question without notice regarding that Broken Hill. How much were you impacted by that power outage a few weeks ago? That sounded pretty... for that whole area.

1:09:11 S13

Yeah, I'm actually, I've been going up there on Sunday of this week, because I've just got constant text messages every other minute saying there's no electricity, there's no gas, there's no, yeah. It was total north looking of the houses. We've got a currently empty at the moment. So we're very lucky regarding that.

1:09:34 S2

Well to anyone listening out in that area, we're very much thinking of you. We're out for a few hours. We get a bit annoyed, but for days it's just a bit more chaos.

1:09:43 S13

Yeah, it's terrible at the moment.

1:09:45 S2

Tony, what made you set it up? What's your background? How did you come to this idea of...

1:09:49 S13

Obviously, I'm... from England, so I... well, when I was in England, I had a disability company in England. Yeah. Work with people with Duchenne muscular dystrophy who were basically paralysed from the neck downwards. I also did a lot of training and a lot of teaching. I teach about 17 subjects mental health, disability, aged care, business management, infection control, health and safety, child protection, community services. So I teach a lot of, range of subjects. So linking with the education and linking with the disability community. So I just thought, Well, we'll commence with this in Australia, what I did in England.

1:10:30 S2

And obviously it's very successful. It's been a good move.

1:10:33 S13

Yes. The... yeah, as part of my teaching registration I had to obviously work in the industry. So I started working for other, other companies and... the other clients and the participants said to me, Why don't you run you off and come back? You have to be more knowledgeable, more better, more empathetic. You know, you're more of a visionary than the company where I'm playing. So it was actually the clients who really pushed me to set up the business. And so that's what, I'm really pleased I've still got those same clients nearly five years later.

1:11:10 S2

Repeat business is so important. What about some of your clients or some of the kind of disability that you work in? Is it kind of across the board as far as different disabilities go?

1:11:20 S13

Well, firstly the... towards our winning this award we use our intensive support program, which is a very unique program that we've introduced. It's a highly specialised, short term intensive program designed to support individuals, families, caregivers and support networks in crisis. This program focuses on short term goals to understand the individual and their needs amidst, well, ensuring the voice is central to the process with its collaboration and its core. Our Intensive Support program provides a platform for the entire support team to engage in a multidisciplinary approach. 

So what we aim is to establish a safety, security and stability for both the individual and their support network. Creating a solid foundation for long term change as the needs transition out of the program. And also we aim to prevent prolonged hospital admissions breakdown in family relationship, significant increases in behaviors of concern or mitigate significant risks of violence, harm to the individual and others. So basically what we do is we really specialise on those participants who are going to be areas of concern. We've got a behavioral practicing Houston team here at, Utopia Care. We're very well established in the industry. We do voluntary out of home care, which is working with child protection, human services, essential needs unit. 

So we work with those really, really difficult people. You know, I've got really challenging behaviors, you know, and we find it rewarding, satisfying. You know, for our community to be able to do this and provide the individual support, as our award says, along with the most outstanding buyer of personalised support in Australia. However, on the 1st of December, we are picking up an award in London which is going to be the the most outstanding award globally. So we've now won the world. So we're now being awarded an accolade for personal support in Australia, but now globally. That's fantastic. Yeah. So I'm really, really pleased about it.

1:13:51 S2

Should be very proud. How do you go for staff, Tony? Because obviously we hear about people sometimes working for organisations. And you talked about empathy before. You hear the comment of they're not empathetic or they just don't understand. It's kind of just the job for them. How do you go for staff? 

1:14:06 S13

Yeah, so what we look for in our work is which we're very lucky. We've had a lot of retention of staff because we're very supportive in our approach towards support workers, because they're on the forefront of our industry. So what we look for is all our support workers, you know, they value our values. So, you know, they've all got integrity. They all collaborate, they all demonstrate empathy, they all provide empowerment. And they're our values for Utopia Care. You know, they've got innate, caring nature. They've got common sense. They've got life experiences. And that's something. What's in it? And that's something. What we can provide in our support workers is those genuine, is caring and it's unique.

1:14:58 S2

Tony, congratulations. Good luck. When you go to London in December, if people want to find out more about Utopia Care, how can we get in touch? You've got a phone number, you've got a website. 

1:15:09 S13

Yeah, yeah. So we've got two offices - in Glenelg on the corner of Anzac Highway and Brighton Road near the KFC. So we've got two offices there. Telephone number is 08 8317 2113. And if you want to contact us via email you can just put Admin at Utopia Care dot com dot AU.

1:15:36 S2

Just before you go, I've got to ask you how did you come up with the name Utopia?

1:15:42 S13

Well, Utopia means where everything is perfect. Yeah. That's it. If you live in Utopia, everything's perfect. You've got everything you want. So I'm saying, come to Utopia. Care where everything's going to be perfect. And it starts - we have a motto, It starts with you.

1:16:02 S2

All right. Tony, congratulations. You're certainly setting a very high standard there, but nothing wrong with that. We wish you well. And as I mentioned before, good luck in London in December and we appreciate you spending some time and enjoy the moment.

1:16:13 S13

Yeah. Thank you for the opportunity. I really appreciate it.

1:16:16 S2

That's Tony Smith there, the person who set up Utopia Care and recently recognised with the National Award and also now an international award as well.

1:16:28 S14

Hi, I'm Pam Mitchell, your resident counsellor, and you're listening to leisure link with Peter Greco on the Vision Australia Radio network. Peter Greco, in tune with the heartbeat of his listeners, linking people together through a program packed with diverse news and up-to-the-minute information... all presented, of course, with his warm heart and vibrant personality.

1:16:57 S2

Well an Australian innovation or invention is potentially going to be helping parents with disabilities with their young kids. Just a bit more about - we've got Carol Taylor on the line. Carol, thanks for your time.

1:17:09 S15

You're very welcome. I'm delighted to be here.

1:17:11 S2

Now, this sounds like a really fantastic thing, and great that it's a kind of Australian led.

1:17:16 S15

Isn't that exciting? Don't you just love to see the Aussies doing it well?

1:17:20 S2

Yes, indeed. Tell us a bit about it. It's called the Care Station. 

1:17:24 S15

The Care Station Baby Capsule. Now, I've got to say, this invention was not around when I had my baby some years ago. But boy oh boy, would it have made a difference. It's a game changer. It really is a game changer. I'm a C5-6 complete quadriplegic, which means that I'm paralysed from the chest down. And I also have completely paralysed hands, although I've got some arm movement. And despite medical advice that I would never be able to carry a child and, you know, they were almost right, it took eight years and 15 embryo transfers. And, you know, finally we got him. And believe it or not, the old fashioned way, when we moved from New South Wales to Queensland, something in the water here. 

But yeah, so it was really challenging. And particularly, you know, having paralysed hands, being able to safely hold, lift and carry my baby without the use of my hands was extremely difficult. And always keeping in mind that, you know, you've got to, you're being warned to protect their neck and head and support and all that sort of thing. And, you know, in addition, navigating tight spaces in a wheelchair while simultaneously caring for a baby, that presents logistical challenges, especially in non-accessible environments. 

Having this care can't station so easily adapted and attached to either a manual or a powered wheelchair would have just been absolutely amazing. It would have made such a difference to the struggles that my husband and I went through with navigating and... trying to juggle all that we did when we had our son. I had to outsource, Peter. I had to outsource so much... you know, changing nappies, dressing, bathing. They were all things that I always imagined as a mum I'd be able to do myself. And outsourcing means that you, you know, you culminate feelings of guilt, and you... worry about your attachment to the baby. 

And there were some pioneers in attachment theory, John Bowlby and Mary Ainsworth. And they were they really focussed on eye contact, and how important eye contact with your baby in those early months of brain development is, so important. And that's where the Care Station comes into its own, because it allows the baby to sit directly in front of your face so you can look, you can look at your baby all day, and he or she can look at you. And their studies say that it released what they call the love hormone oxytocin. Yeah. And that really helps with attachment, emotional intelligence. But, you know, if you read their studies. 

But what it doesn't do is pretty phenomenal. You know, it's critical. This eye contact is critical for brain development and attachment in the early years of a baby's life, according to these professionals. So I'm not going to argue with them.

1:20:07 S2

Yeah, it's very powerful. I guess the other thing is, another thing is with the, you know, sort of outsourcing, as you say, depending on who's available when and that sort of thing. I mean, you know, with something like the Care Station, you can kind of do it whenever you want.

1:20:21 S15

You know, it's, that's, you hit the nail on the head, Peter. When I had our son, I, you know, outsourcing, like my... outsourcing is rather a harsh word, I've got... I'm very fortunate to have a wonderful husband who was very hands-on, but I also had support workers' help. But I almost envied everything they, I wanted to do. I've waited so long for this kid. I wanted to do it all. So it did lead to feelings of frustration and guilt. So therefore you really value whatever little bit you can do entirely by yourself. If I had the Care Station, I would have been able to go for a wander with my son by myself, have one-on-one time and feel safe and know that he was safe. That's something I didn't have. So I lacked autonomy, which then affected my confidence, I think. 

So, you know, as a parent in those early, early months in particular. So the Care Station would have been an absolute game changer for me, to enable me to move independently and have that, as I said, that face-to-face contact and all the extra benefits of being able to navigate spaces, shopping centres, my home, wherever. Apart from being an Aussie design, the other thing that I'm extremely proud of is to see such progress in inclusive design, to support people with disability. And, you know, designs like the Care Station, they really help, in my opinion, to normalise parenting with disability. 

I certainly experienced a bit of backlash when I had our son. People had a lot to comment and unsolicited advice and comments. And, you know, Are you sure you're up to this, and Unfair burden on your husband and so on. So I think this is, this development, this invention is just awesome to raise awareness of, you know, of parenting with disability. The fact that there are many of us that have disability and are parents and it's a completely normal thing and we adjust and, you know, wonderful inventions like this just helps to make it better and easier for us.

1:22:19 S2

Those comments, which might be well-meaning are so unhelpful, aren't they? So deflating in a sense. And you must put, you know, self-doubt in your mind as well.

1:22:28 S15

Oh, look, they did. They definitely did. I had, you know, people say to me... really, one of my support workers at the time felt, you know, Doesn't your husband have enough to cope with?

1:22:39 S2

Oh, wow.

1:22:40 S15

Yeah. Besides you putting this unfair burden on him. And I was like, You have no idea what our relationship is. How dare they? He wants this just as much as I do, you know. And we certainly never looked back. I mean, it's been the joy of our life. Our world revolves around him. And, you know, I, I think, as you know, parents with disabilities can parent just as well as anyone else.

1:23:01 S2

But they can do everything else just as well, can't they? And often better, you know, if it's employment or indeed anything else, that's education, etc.. So do you know much about its availability? It's... an Australian innovation, an Australian invention. Do you know much about its availability?

1:23:16 S15

I know that it's available through Move Mobility.

1:23:19 S2

Ah, yes. You've spoken to people from Move before?

1:23:22 S15

Yeah... you speak to John at Move Mobility or any of the competent staff there and they will look after you. You certainly need to give this a trial. Honestly, Peter, in my opinion, it's a game changer. Really is.

1:23:34 S2

Well, coming from someone like you, that means like... Carol, thanks so much for speaking to us. I know you've got a very successful career away from being a mum. Maybe we can save that for another time. But thank you for spending a bit of time with this, and we'll put information up on our show notes regarding the the Care Station and also John's contact details. So we appreciate you speaking to us. We wish you well.

1:23:55 S15

You're very welcome, Peter. It was my pleasure. Have a lovely day.

1:23:58 S2

That's lovely. Carol Taylor there, chatting about the Care Station Australia invention, hopefully making parenting even better for parents with their young children with disabilities. 

Some footnotes to the show. You may remember that we now put our show notes up with information such as phone numbers and websites. So if you're ever after any information there, consult the show notes for links and phone numbers. 

I've got to say a big cheerio to Bernie. I always say, look, if you can get in touch with us any way you can, we end up getting the message. Well, Bernie did actually email the national call centre, the donation line at Vision Australia, and they got the message through to me that Bernie had an idea for an interview and we actioned that and we did the interview. So, Bernie, thank you very much for your suggestion. Thank you for your kind words about the show as well. It just goes to show if you want to contact us, there are all sorts of ways you can always call the radio station on 1300 847 466 any time of the day or night. Leave a message, just mention leisure link or Sunday afternoon or my name or Vision Australia, Radio Adelaide and they will get the message. And if there's an idea that you'd like to share with us, I will get back to you and we will action it as we did with Bernie. So, Bernie, thank you again for tuning in.

A couple of quotes. Oh, before I do that, some, I think a really, I think the first time I've seen this in the commercial world during the week, the Nine entertainment company NEC, ASX listed, released their quarterly report and talked about the fact that their month ending the 30th of September, their revenue was up quite a bit thanks to advertising from the Olympics and Paralympics. I reckon it's one of the very few times that an ASX-listed company in an ASX post would have mentioned Olympics and Paralympics in that particular post. So a bit of a breakthrough there, and certainly shows how important the Paralympics were to Nine. Not just the Olympics, but the Paralympics as well. A great thing, particularly going forward. History in the making. Maybe put that down in the diary. November 2024 a day that Paralympics arrived. 

As far as being mentioned on the Australian Stock Exchange goes a couple of quotes before we go. Actually, one quote before we go - Konrad, not our Conrad from [Vision] Australia Radio, but Konrad with a K, Konrad. Konrad says, You only have one chance to make a first impression. The sky is still the limit. So Conrad, thanks so much for that. And our old friend Agenda, the best taxi driver in the world has given me some information. During the week when we were having a chat about most things shooting the breeze, as they like to say. He says, Did you know that in the US, presidents and vice presidents, when they're in office, are not allowed to drive on the public roads? I'll take your word for it, Agenda, as you get ready for hopefully a very busy Saturday night. 

A couple of birthdays before we go. Amanda Fraser having a birthday. Paralympic swimmer for Australia. Amanda, a big happy birthday to you and Ron. Who's having a birthday formally as CEO of Virgin Australia. Ron, happy birthday to you. Look forward to maybe catching up with you and talking a bit of cricket sometime in the future. Sam, Richard, thanks so much for your help. Pam Green, thank you so much for yours. If you're listening through 1190 7 a.m. in Adelaide, keep that door locked in because coming up very, very shortly, the amazingly wonderful Vicki Cousins is here with the extraordinary, exceptional Australian Geographic program. 

Be kind to yourselves. Be thoughtful of others. Look out for others. All being well, let's look back at the same time next week. This is Vision Australia Radio. The program is Leisure Link.