What's My Future?

00:05 Sam Rizzo

Hi, I'm Sam Rizzo, Australian Paralympic athlete and winner of this year's Oz Day 10-K. And you're listening to leisure link with Peter Greco on the Vision Australia radio network.

00:39 Peter

It's just gone 5:00 as we channel a bit of Imagine Dragons on top of the world... I'm certainly on top of the world, being able to welcome you to leisure link here on Vision Australia Radio 1197 AM in Adelaide, online at VA radio, VA Radio Digital in Adelaide and Darwin through the Community Radio Plus app. Look for Vision Australia Radio Adelaide. Your favourite podcast or streaming service will also [?]... If you're listening through 103.9 Hope FM in Esperance in Western Australia, a very big hello to you and a very big hello and thank you to Disability Media Australia for their tremendous support. You can find out more about them including Leisure Link by going to Powered Media - powerd.media ...

Peter Greco saying wonderful to be here. This program coming to you from Kaurna Land. Coming to you very shortly... we'll meet a wonderful athlete, Sam Rizzo, who's just fresh from winning the Oz 10K and a bit of time overseas. We'll find out about that. We'll catch up with Reggie Sorensen, who's just back from South Africa. Reggie was on I'm a Celebrity Get Me Out of Here. How'd it go? We'll find out very soon. David Mitchell will give you a bit of get up and go - some foods that you can eat, get a bit more energy back into your life or that that's good for your heart. Belinda Hellyer will join us - talk about tisanes. What are they? We'll find out from Belinda. 

Nat Cook will join us, Minister for Human Services. Lots of things to talk about... [?] there, including employment for people with disabilities and the public sector and other things. Sam Connor AM will join us - recognised in this year's Australia Day Awards. Sam will also give a bit of a reflection on International Women's Day coming up. We'll also catch up with Cheryl Boniface, who will talk to us about What's My Future - a website, a campaign that's just been launched. If you or someone you know is working in the area of disability, you'll want to hear that. 

Well, it's been a very busy but also successful and exciting time for our guest, Sam Rizzo, who joins us. Sam, thanks for coming. Welcome.

02:46 Sam R

Thank you very much for having me, I appreciate it.

02:47 Peter

Now you've... well, actually, you're just back from being overseas, but early this year, you won the Oz Day 10K.

02:53 Sam R

Yeah, been a pretty busy year so far... we're in our summer season, so, yeah, lots of track meets and road races His round started off in January at Canberra for the Summer Down Under series three of competing on the track, and then we headed over to Sydney for the ten kilometre road race over there and then a few days after, jumped on a plane and went over to the Middle East to compete in Dubai and Sharjah.

03:19 Peter

He won the Oslo 10K. That wasn't the first time you won it, was it?

03:22 Sam R

Oh, no. I've been doing that race... well, I reckon since 2016. I might have missed 1 or 2 during COVID times, but love supporting the event. It's, you know, a beautiful race with the Sydney Harbour Bridge and all the other sights that you get to see. I'm painting around the rocks one of a couple of times as a junior. Yeah, but won it for the first time as an open probably in '20, oh, I want to say '22 or '23 and then had a bit of an off year. So set it out and then it jumped back in and managed to sneak in for the win again.

03:57 Peter

I'm thinking that given the fact that you're writing, you probably don't really have much time to take in the opera house and the harbour.

04:03 Sam R

Oh, no. Look, every so often you might stick your head up and have a little, little quick second look around, but, um. Nah, it's pretty, pretty hard racing this year. And, um. Yeah, the boys gave me a good run for my money. Um, yeah. So pretty, pretty speedy. And and lots. Uh, not not much of time to to have a little look around, but. Yeah.

04:24 Peter

Is it a good course to race on? Is it a good course to go to get a good time?

04:28 Sam R

It's a very tactical course. Yeah, there's there's quite a few turns and a few hairpin turns, which, I don't, my chair doesn't handle the best. So that kind of came to show... coming up against guys like Kiwi from Japan who uses every little part of that road to his advantage and goes around turns, and it doesn't even affect him. So it's my my kind of favorite type of racing. Yeah, I do love a tactical course. And... a few hills and down hills and lots of turns. Yeah. Try and like, you know, I know my strengths and my weaknesses, and I try and play it when I can. And, yeah, just go with race and see how we go each time.

05:12 Peter

I guess as an athlete, that's kind of your forte, isn't it, to know your strengths and weaknesses?

05:16 Sam R

Yeah, yeah. Got to got to be adaptable to every possibility that it can be.

05:20 Peter

And then you did go overseas. So where did you go and how did you go and why did you go? 

05:25 Sam R

Yeah. So a couple of us went over to the Middle East, flew to Dubai and then drove to Sharjah first, uh, for a track meet over there. We go there to try and get qualifying standards for each world major. Yeah, because it's IPC registered and... falls within the qualifying period. It's early enough in our season, um, where if you can get a decent time on the board, it kind of takes a little bit of stress off later in the year. So you're not needing to worry as much. Pretty... decent conditions over there. It's a night comp, so yeah... historically we've got them pretty decent times over there. So it's one extra year that. Yeah, just like heading over and yeah, can always get decent times as... heats deep. So pretty... decent comp. And then after we drive back to Dubai, stay there for about five days until we compete again on the track for another shootout.

06:22 Peter

What's it like over there in terms of... particularly competition for athletes with disabilities? Of course, we've seen in more recent years that football, soccer has sort of recruited some high profile players into the competitions over there. I know our cricketers go over there. Of course, at the moment the Champions Trophy with cricket is on in India playing their games in that part of the world. Is it kind of you sort of user friendly for athletes with disabilities as well?

06:47 Sam R

Yeah. Look we definitely we definitely get looked after over there. Um, there's a police escort to and from the um, accommodation to the to the track mate. So, um. Yeah, definitely. You know, they make sure we're there on time and looked after its athletes. So. Yeah, pretty, pretty big comp, um, you know, medal ceremony. Yeah. Yeah. It's it's one, it's one I do like to go to each year. So I'm pretty happy with it. No complaints from me.

07:13 Peter

There's a little bit of prizemoney around these days for wheelchair racers.

07:16 Sam R

Yeah, mainly. Mainly on road... a bit on track, depending on where you go throughout the world and what event that they are. But yeah, the main... big money comes from marathons in the like. And yeah, that road races, it's harder to get paid for track winnings unless you're in that, you know, top ten inches the world and you go to a Diamond League invite only type of thing, but it seems to be coming more common for some decent prize money. Yeah.

07:48 Peter

You were selected for your first Paralympic Games?

07:51 Sam R

Yeah. So I got selected for the Paris Paralympics last year after a pretty decent year, coming away with a decent handful of qualifying times. Then that goes to a selection process with Athletics Australia, and then selected athletes are notified. And then, um, they just continued preparation. But yeah, it just prepare and do all the comps and all the training like you're heading over. Yeah. But then once you get that final tick of approval, it... takes a bit of weight off the shoulders and it can just go in knowing you've... done, done all the work and just go and enjoy the experience. 

08:30 Peter

And you did okay. I mean, you didn't make any finals, but I guess the experience would have been great. And, you know, wheelchair racing-wise, you're still quite young really, aren't you? Sort of sort of year-wise, but also experience-wise.

08:40 Sam R

Yeah. Yeah. So I've, I've kind of just... you know, made my first open team... really at comp games in 2018, but my first open world team just the other year after, you know, narrowly missing out on getting qualifying times for the Tokyo Paralympics. But then, you know, you go home, you train harder. And with that goal in mind of doing better than what you did. And yeah, that went to show after the times got harder then what they did for Tokyo. And you know, I managed to come away with quite a number and even a great qualifying standard, which I thought might have been a little bit out of reach. 

But yeah, like I said, I had a good, good years of training and yeah, got in a good race and managed to go with it and. Yeah, here we are.

09:28 Peter

Oh, do you credit to your coach?

09:29 Sam R

Oh, absolutely. I've got a great team. Yeah. Like I always talk about, you know, it takes a village to produce an athlete. I certainly couldn't do it without me. Like, I've got... fantastic ski coach and physio and nutrition team behind me and coach. Yeah, yeah. No I certainly and support network at home and friends and family. Yeah, yeah. Can't can't be doing what I do without them.

09:55 Peter

Do you like that kind of professional approach? I mean, you're literally. Well, not literally. You are an elite athlete. You kind of train as one, you prepare as one?

10:04 Sam R

Oh, yeah. Absolutely, yeah, we we do it because we love it. You know, little eight year old Sam - I think I was thinking the other day that, you know, looking back, you'd be pretty chuffed with what we've achieved so far... as a 24 year old. Yeah. I don't think, you know, he wanted to go to a Paralympics and win gold and get world records. So, you know, we're taking our stepping stones there, but, you know, take a take a step back and have a look at what we've done and where we are. You know, I think I think that's something to be pretty proud of.

10:36 Peter

Indeed. How did you get into the sport, particularly into wheelchair racing? Because I guess there's lots of different opportunities for people with disabilities in terms of their sporting options out there.

10:45 Sam R

Yeah, absolutely... yeah. So go back to 2008... I've got spina bifida. It's a neural tube defect, leaving me unable to walk or stand so wheelchair bound. Yeah. So go to 2008. I went to a spina bifida family camp in Phillip Island for a weekend. So just once a year, a little bit of a holiday retreat where people around from Victoria, with... spina bifida and their friends and family come and yeah, we just all get to know each other and a little bit of community based. 

And there was a guy called Richard Coleman who... yeah... he was doing doing athletics and doing quite well. And he was giving a bit of a bit of a story and a spiel about what he does and who he is and what he's up to, and brought a few race chairs and, you know, he had won a few medals at this time, you know, in Athens and on previous world world champs. Yeah. And I was lucky enough where I got to, got to jump in a race chair to... you know, just to sit it and see how it feels. And... you know, got Richard Coleman's autograph on on my wheel. Yeah. 

So, yeah, fast forward later that year to the Paralympics in Beijing. I'm pretty certain it was the first time I watched the Paralympics and tuned in to watch his race. Because, you know, it's someone, you know, and, uh, yeah, he he medaled yet again. And I'm like, Oh, gee, I don't don't know how, but I know that's what I want to do when, when I'm all older. And given that opportunity, I'm certainly going to jump at it. And then fast forward to probably 2012, 2013. He got in contact with me because he's been an hour away from where where I live in Victoria. 

And yeah, he's like, Oh, you want to give... track a go? We've got a chair here that would probably work for you. It's like a not even a second hand. It was probably fourth or fifth or sixth hand chair type of thing that just got passed on and passed on for people to come and give this sport a try. And yeah, fast forward to now. Just just moved on from Richard as my coach, but we had an absolutely amazing time together. Going from, you know, absolutely nothing to to making multiple world finals and making my first Paralympic team together... yeah.... in little rural Australia. So that's that's that story. 

13:08 Peter

That's great. Great sort of insight into what meeting an athlete Paralympian can do for, for an eight year old or for, I guess, for any young person coming through, isn't it? That's such a a powerful story. Kind of simple but powerful.

13:20 Sam

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely.

13:21 Peter

Well, what about ahead of you now then? Because as I said, you're still young, particularly racing wise. What do you kind of target in the next sort of 12 months. You kind of look at sort of a year ahead and sort of go from there or... yeah.

13:32 Sam

Last year I was thinking that... last year was pretty busy and was looking forward to a bit of an easy year, but, no, I've, I moved... to Canberra... to set myself in in a better position. You know, put myself full time athlete um, training now. So moved up to there. Um, there's a really good coach called Fred Perry up there and, um, training with Sam Carter, which is, you know, Australia's, um, current best wheelchair T54 athlete. And, um. Yeah. So you're around fast people. You're bound to go faster. I've worked worked with Fred on on team trips before and, um, love the way he does stuff. So, um, that was that was all part of that move to better myself. As for the next 12 months, we've got world champs later in the year, so we're just working towards getting qualifying standards for that, which I think are due to be released this week from Athletics Australia. So we can get a better idea on on what those times are and if we already have some. If not, yeah, we'll be going going over to Europe to try and get more times in May and June. So hopefully we've already got some, but if not, we've got a really good opportunity over there. So just continue training and yeah, go, go hit those target mates. And uh, there could be a few road races throughout the year as well that we're looking at. But yeah, just get ready for, for I guess our winter season, go over to Europe and make it the summer season. So it's kind of an all all round year sport at the moment. Yeah. But we are looking forward to worlds later in the year in springtime and then probably a week break and then we get ready for summer Down Under all over again in January.

15:11 S2

Get away from the Act and the Victorian winter. Sam, great to meet you. First time. Congratulations on what you've achieved so far. I sense there's lots more chapters to be written in the Sam Russo story. We look forward to following your progress and hopefully speak to you again in the future.

15:26 S1

Thank you. I appreciate.

15:27 S2

It. That's Sam Russo there, very bright upcoming Paralympic athlete in the world of wheelchair racing. Look out for that name, Sam Russo. Results. Well, we've been very lucky over the years to catch up with Reggie Sorensen on a semi-regular basis. Reggie is just back from I'm A Celebrity Get Me Out of Here! Reggie love to catch up, but thanks so much for your time. Oh, thank you.

15:53 S4

For having me. It's always a pleasure talking to you.

15:56 S2

Now, all the stuff that you've been doing a little bit crooked at the moment.

15:59 S4

Yes. Um, after being in the South African jungle, I've, um. I got sick in the last week, uh, while I was in there, just with a bit of a cough. But since I've arrived back in Australia, it's just got worse. So sorry if I coughed during this interview.

16:15 S2

Oh, well, thank you for being available. What was the experience like?

16:19 S4

Oh, look, it was absolutely amazing. Um, I've always wanted to go on I'm A Celebrity. And when I got the opportunity to do so, I. I couldn't believe it. Like, I and I even though I'm absolutely petrified of snakes and spiders and heights and bugs and all that kind of stuff. I thought, no, I've got to do this. It's, uh. Yeah, once in a lifetime opportunity, and I'm so glad that I did it. It was just. It's unbelievable how awesome it was.

16:50 S2

We've chatted to you about Big Brother. This is kind of completely different, isn't it?

16:54 S4

Yes. Totally. Like. Like it's similar to where you're, you know, you're sleeping with people and you're in that group of people, and like, I managed to, um, get through that mentally. Okay. Compared to the other campmates, because a lot of the campmates sort of struggled with, with the whole sitting around and doing nothing and. Yeah. So yeah, so for me that was the eye that I breezed through that because I'm used to doing three months at a time locked up in a house, but this was only a one month. So it was, it was that part was easy. Um, the hardest, hardest parts about it was. Yeah. Doing those horrible eating trial challenges and then doing the challenges which which were hard. But yeah, look I managed to get through it.

17:42 S2

I'd like to how about you can tell us. But how much do you know before going in of the sort of things that you might be asked to do? Because some of them are quite outrageous, aren't they? So scary. You've got to eat this incredibly, uh, unappealing food, all that sort of stuff.

17:57 S4

Yeah. So because because I've always watched the show. So you sort of got an idea what what you are in for, like eating, you know, like I had to eat a bull's penis, and I'm like, this was. And that was like chewing a thong, a rubber thong. It was disgusting. But yeah, you don't really like, you don't know anything or what they're going to do day. Every day was so different in there. Um, because you just did not know what was around the corner. So. But yeah, the challenges were hard. You know, the very first day I got there, I had to jump off the side of a mountain. Oh my goodness, because I'm absolutely petrified of heights. And I had a choice. I could have walked 22 K's around this big dam back to camp or do or jump off the side of the the mountain and, um, yeah. And I said to the crew, I said, I'm going to walk. And they said, well, who's going with you? And I'm like, I had no choice. But I had to walk the plank and jump. Jump off to catch a star. Uh, which we got. You had to get stars so you could get food for for camp. Yeah. And that was, um, I just I couldn't believe I actually did it. So it was because it was so high up. It was crazy.

19:09 S2

Ricky, you talked about all the other camp mates as well. I guess that's one of the things you kind of, you know, you're very vulnerable, actually, because you're a long time together and a long time alone, if I can put it that way. Yes. Yeah, yeah. Gotta find things to talk about and to sort of while away the hours.

19:24 S4

Yeah, totally. Because when you're not on a trial, you're sitting in camp and it gets very, very boring. Very boring. And there's only so much you can talk about, you know, like at the beginning, a lot of the campmates would just full on, like it was very in-your-face because they wouldn't shut up. And then by by the end of it it was very quiet. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

19:46 S2

Anyone in particular that you kind of got on really well with that? Maybe you're a bit surprised.

19:51 S4

Oh gosh. Well yeah. Oh gosh. I got along with, with a lot of the campmates I guess like Matty J. He was lovely. He um because Sam thought he was great as well. Like, he, like he at the start he goes, I'll be your guide dog Reggie. So he used to, you know, help me, guide me, um, around the place. And then when he stopped doing it, um, Matty J took over. So. Yeah. So they were my two guide dogs whilst in camp. Um, you know, they used to help me navigate. When we used to go to the ward, there was this waterfall, and it would be like a ten 15 minute trek to the waterfall. But it was lots of uphills, lots of tree roots, lots of rocks to climb over and like I could not do it by myself. So the guy all the, you know, all the camp mates would help me, guide me, um, hold my hand and help me get through that walk. So, um. Yeah. So Maddy was loving Max, I loved Max, Nicky Buckley was lovely. Sigrid Thornton was just beautiful. Um, Geraldine Hickey, she was hilarious. Dave Hughes absolutely loved Dave Hughes. He was so funny. And, um, just so glad that he was in camp. He was. He was amazing. Yeah.

21:09 S2

It's interesting when someone is kind of has to go, you can sort of sense that they are really emotional and there's a real bond between you guys, isn't there? When someone goes, you all feel it.

21:19 S4

Yes. And I was hopeless. And and I would go into the toktokkie, which is where we spoke to the producers. It was like Big brother, you know, like a big brother diary room where you go and talk and, you know, and I said, I've done, I've done two big brothers. And I said, and I'm still crying when people bloody leave. So it was weird. Yeah, it's really weird. It's hard to explain. But you do get attached very quickly to people and when they leave, it is it's upsetting when they go.

21:47 S2

What about your kind of, um, sort of vulnerability in terms of, uh, some of the things you talk about that there's a lot of tears. Are you kind of okay with that? Is that kind of view or do you kind of know it's going to happen? So you kind of just got to go with the flow? How does that kind of all play out?

22:03 S4

Yeah. So there were some nights in there where we were asked questions. Um, and uh, a lot of people opened up about their past and what's happened in their lives, and some were very eye opening, to be honest. And and I don't know what's been shown. I'm only up to episode two watching it back, so, um, but I'm. I'm very out there. Like, I just say it how it is, and I'm, I'm not afraid to be open and honest about anything in my life. Probably sometimes speak too much about about things, but no, like it was. Um, it was interesting hearing a lot of the the campmates stories. Yeah, very.

22:42 S2

There's a lot of, a lot of those things, I guess a lot of us about most a lot most of those people we wouldn't have known about, I guess because we've spoken to you a few times and we've kind of got to know you a little bit away from the show, so we kind of know a little bit more about you, but some of those things, as you say, they're very, very personal and you kind of think, oh, you can sort of sense their uncomfortableness that there's such a word about it. But by the same token, I guess it's probably good to sort of get out of your comfort zone as well. Yes.

23:07 S4

Yeah. Look, I, I was happy to, um, bring a lot of awareness to my eye. Disease, um, retinitis pigmentosa. And also, Lucas, you know, illness having cystic fibrosis. Um, so I'm glad that I got to have a chance to speak about that. And and even just going on the show, I was like, oh, you know, I'm, I'm about to show the, you know, Australia a lot about my eye disease. And um, some people get it, but there are a lot of lot of trolls. Um, I've never been trolled so much in my life on social media. Yeah. It's, um, just so many people saying that I'm faking my eye disease, like my blindness and, you know, but I went into the show wanting to have a crack and have a go and and to show to people that who live with a disability that, you know, you can do things, you can get out there and keep going and don't give up. And unfortunately, a lot I'm coping so much crap. Um, yeah. Saying that I'm faking my my blindness. But, you know, that's all I can do is keep on going and try not to let that get to me, but it's it's really hard. Yeah.

24:20 S2

That's ignorance though, isn't it? Because like when you say you're blind or have a vision, impairment doesn't necessarily mean you can't see anything.

24:27 S4

No I know.

24:28 S2

And I think one of the things about people like you is that you use the limited sight that you had so very well, that it's actually a compliment, if I can put it that way, that people think you're a fake because you're using the little sight that you have to the to the best of your ability.

24:42 S4

Oh, absolutely. Like I I'm so proud of myself. Yeah. Uh, for all the things that I did in, in, in camp there and, you know, and especially like at the beginning when I had to jump off the cliff and walk the plank like I had Sam Thaiday in, I could hear him in the back of my head in the background going Ridge, you go left a bit, go left a bit. You're about to walk off the side of the plank because I didn't want to look down at all because it was so high. But, you know, like I, I navigated my way through it all, and because I wasn't sure how I was going to go in there, but once I, you know, I got to know where the toilet was and where I had to wash my hands and where the campfire was all that kind of stuff. Once I navigated through that, I was I was okay. But walking through the tunnel in there, there used to be a rock. A big rock would stick out of the ground, and I'd trip on it every single time I'd walk through there. And all the campmates called it Reggie's Rock. So yeah, it's like, oh gosh. But um, no, but yeah, I just it goes to show a lot of people still need education about blindness because, uh oh, they just it's it's truly unbelievable how much, um, people don't know about vision impairment and blindness. It's it's crazy.

26:01 S2

Yeah. Not for me to tell you what you should and shouldn't do, but like, with the with the trolling, etc., you kind of get support or help or counselling in that area because, uh, you know, it doesn't happen to people like me, but that that must be a bit relentless when, when it's happening and and when it's obviously offensive and also wrong.

26:18 S4

Oh, look, I've got my sister still here. She came into the show to surprise me with me and my daughter, but my sister's still here at the moment. Um, but. And because I get on there to, like, respond back to people and I get tagged in posts and, and then and then she's going, can you just get off there and stop reading all the negative and. Yeah. Um, but I said it's hard. It's hard like, you got you got lots of love as well. But then you've got those, they're just putting you down and saying that you're fake and you know, it's awful. And like, I've been posting a lot of videos, um, before I went in. And when I got to see, like, a giraffe and I got to see a zebra and and people are on there going, oh, you can see like, you know, you're fake.

27:03 S2

You it's like, yeah, this is ignorance isn't it? That's pure ignorance.

27:07 S4

Yeah. But that I.

27:08 S2

That I don't understand that you can't have some sort.

27:11 S4

Of insight. Yes. Yeah. Because like I've always said, you know, I've got nine degrees of pinhole vision. And I'm very blessed and thankful that I do still have, you know, that tiny bit of vision left, like, because it is all going to go eventually. And, um, I'm very thankful for what I, what I can see at the moment. You know, it's, um, you know, but unfortunately, some people think when you say you're blind that you can't see anything.

27:36 S2

Yeah, yeah. And of course, some people think if you're blind, you're also not very bright. But we know that's not true.

27:43 S4

Oh, gosh.

27:44 S2

I read it without being too personal. What was the first thing you did when you get home that you kind of, you know, that you kind of miss? What sort of creature comfort had you missed that you you really welcomed when you got home?

27:55 S4

Um, probably going down to the league's club and having a beer.

28:01 S2

That's very. Reggie. Oh. Reggie?

28:03 S4

Yes, yes, yes. I missed that. Yeah. But, um. No. You take for granted a the little things in life. Just having a warm shower, using a toilet, washing your hands from, you know, running, tapping it like that. Oh, it's just unbelievable what we take for granted in life.

28:22 S2

I was just going to mention to you when you talked about once you knew where the toilet was and where you could wash your hands, there'd be a lot of people who are blind or have low vision that would know the same thing. When you go somewhere you haven't been before, you kind of want to know where those things are just in case you need them instead of. Yeah, that's a lot of people can identify with that.

28:37 S4

Oh, look, it is like when you're taking into an unfamiliar territory, it is very daunting. And until you work your way around where you are, like, it's like it took me a little bit to get used to everything, but, um, yeah, it's very daunting when you don't know where things are. It's overwhelming actually. Yeah, yeah.

28:59 S2

We're out of time. But just before I go, I've got to say we obviously spoke to you and Karen, also from, uh, Queensland, about the Blind Australian of the year award from Link visions. Afterwards, we spoke to Courtney and Penny, the two winners.

29:14 S4

Oh, lovely.

29:15 S2

And they loved you. You were. You were the highlight of their night. I think they enjoyed meeting you more than they enjoyed their awards. Oh.

29:21 S4

Bless them. How lovely is that? Gosh, it was such a great night, too. It was. That was awesome.

29:27 S2

Yeah. And, Courtney. Courtney remembered you in the latest, Big Brother. I don't think she was born when you were in the first one.

29:34 S4

Oh, gosh. She's only gone. Yeah.

29:37 S5

There you are. All right.

29:39 S4

Well, no. It's beautiful.

29:41 S2

Thank you for speaking to us. You've been beautiful as well. Thank you so, so much. I know you've just been back and also getting over your cold, so thank you for speaking to us. I look forward to the next time we speak, but well done and keep spreading the good word.

29:52 S4

We'll do. Thank you for having me. It's always a pleasure.

29:55 S5

To.

29:55 S2

Read your thoughts. And they're fresh from the South African jungle from I'm a Celebrity. Get Me Out of Here! You're in elite company listening to Leslie here on Vision Radio.

30:07 S6

Radio VA radio, Radiators.

30:08 S2

To.

30:09 S6

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30:10 UU

And through the TuneIn radio app.

30:28 S2

We're right about this time the first week of each month. It's always great to welcome David Mitchell to the program. Our host. Commentator. David, welcome aboard again.

30:36 S7

Hello, Peter. Good afternoon everyone. I thought we should call this the show today. The. Get up, get going and get on with your life program, because we got to talk about some some exciting, useful, easy stuff that we could we can be doing. We're all ears, right? So it's all. That's right. Yeah. I can see what you're getting at. I can hear what you're saying. And it feels good to me. We hadn't talked about nitric acid or. Sorry. Nitric oxide. Nitric oxide is a compound that our body bakes that its job is to relax blood vessels, which means that blood vessels can expand or become bigger to allow more, more blood to flow through. Which means that the delivery to the various sites that the blood goes is improved. So in the case of if it goes to the brain, then the brain gets more blood. The brain works better, we're brighter, we're lighter, we're thinking better, and we're getting up and doing things. If it goes to the muscles and the muscles start to work better. So not only do lazy stiff muscles or injured muscles, they all get fed more blood so the muscles can expand and they can work better, and they become more powerful and they become more useful. And so we can not only get up and get going, we can keep going for a whole lot longer. Interestingly, it's in its early phase of discovery about nitric oxide, and they've discovered that it also increased the size or relax the blood vessels in the penis, which meant more blood flow, which meant that the males started to get more of a stiffy. Because that's that's how erections work. Is is the blood flows into the penis, swells up the blood vessels in the penis, then becomes stick and tighten upright and upstanding. So again, it's all again about get up and get going. And now, obviously over time that that particular session got overtaken by Viagra and Cialis and all the other drugs in that area. But he does had some effect in that area. Yeah. It it's also because it is working on muscle and brain, and it's thought that it may also help people that are overweight or in the pre-diabetic phase or even into diabetes, because we know in, in diabetes and before that that you tend to have increasing cholesterol, increasing blockage in blood vessels and also less blood flow. So again, in taking it that diabetes, people may find that they have a bit more get up and go. They may also find their blood sugar control is a bit more even. And because the the nitric oxide is actually dealing with the muscle power and endurance and stamina and so on, so it can be useful. And lastly, it came to claim because of the the gym junkies and athletes, because they found that when they took or made or took a supplement that made more nitric oxide, that their muscles were stronger so they could lift weights more easily and their muscles had greater endurance, they not only could they keep doing reps at the gym, but they could also run around the block a bit faster than they could before, which was pretty exciting. The only thing about it was that they found that once you reach a certain level of fitness, it didn't work any better. So the beauty of this stuff is that you're looking at tracking it for X amount of time, which may be weeks to months, probably months. Then you can leave it on for a while. Then if you start to find that you're dropping back in your performance or you're not getting up, get going and get on with it. If that's not happening like it was a few months before, then you go back onto it. So it's quite fascinating in that way. Now all this sounds pretty good and that's the theories behind the whole thing. But it is to do with how do I get it? Well, we don't know a lot of these sorts of things. As we get older, we're less efficient and we can get them from food. And really the best food for it is beetroot. Now, I personally hate beetroot and Pam actually loves beetroot. And I hear that that there's Peter Greco, who's on the radio all the time, and he's pretty fit and healthy, and he reckons that beetroot is is is a wonder. So now we know why he's so Sparky. But All day, and even up to and including 530 on Sunday afternoons. And because Peter has has a large amount of the chemical called a nitrate, and nitrates are turned by the body into nitric oxide, which then does all these amazing things that 50 or 100ml a day of beetroot. Now my my stomach turned over the mere thought of that. But for those that that is a lie. But congratulations, you've got a cheap and easy way of actually getting increased performance in the brain and the muscles in the heart. I forgot to mention the heart. This heart is a muscle, so it gives it these lots of nitric oxide. And we need to get the blood vessels in the heart open, because if we don't, we start getting angina and heart attacks and had all sorts of operations and pills and those sorts of things. So keeping that in mind, this is where you're going, that the beetroot could be the salvation, embedded commerce, or at least a help in those areas without doing any harm. And it's always important that if we're taking something for a particular reason, one, we need the reason why we're doing it. Two, we want to make sure that it's safe for us. It doesn't fix food is food is a good way to go. Um, and we're talking about big food is is the number one leafy green vegetables, including that dreadful trendy one called kale, which I also personally hate. Uh, that spinach is is another one. They also have lots of nitrates. So good on the people that like these. I congratulate you and and and I hope you're even better than I am because you're taking it. Uh, if you're not taking it, please give it some thoughts. Citrus fruits are also a part of it. Okay. They also help. And as we know, as we get older, we don't have as much in the way of of fruits, including the citrus fruits that we get older and lazier or we don't, we feel full up and don't have the, the piece of fruit at the end of the meal, like we used to do when we were kids, all grown up. Let's say it's some environment C or increasing the amount of of the citrus fruits would be useful. You can run down a list for a few others, but essentially if we just did and focused on those particular foodstuffs, we would be doing our blood vessels a lovely treat. That would help not only the blood oxygen source, but it would help us in those different ways. Now there will be people that say, well, like Mitchell, we don't like those things like pills. What else is available? Well, luckily, particularly because of the gym junkies, there is a plethora of nitric oxide stimulants or compounds that can be turned into nitric acid, nitric oxide in the body. And in particular there are two major chemicals. One is L-arginine. It's an amino acid, an important one, and the other one is l-citrulline. Because got the word citrus in it means it comes from or is part of the. Well, we're saying that citric fruits are the reason. There is a compound called citric acid that is used in these pills. So they're the number one. Number two. They also found that resveratrol and that came into contact when we had that French maritime bark extract. Then they found it was and resveratrol gets used in a lot of the trendy health magazines about being good for you and lots of different ways. Well, one of the reasons is because it is used in the manufacture of the nitric oxide in the body. So it's it's worth remembering that. So when you when you are looking at the what do I buy to be looking at ones that that had either the mention of beetroot extract or citric or arginine or some vitamin C, and even coenzyme Q10 has also been shown to be useful. After that, you will see that most of the trendy ones will have about four or 5 or 6 different things. Rule of thumb is the more they have to put into a pill, the less good it's going to do. They're just taking a stab in the dark about what might work or what could work. Or let's put it in there anyway, because it's good for other reasons. But if you're seriously looking at at it for what it's doing, which is to do the nitrates into the system or into the nitric oxide to be made by the body, then you're keeping it down to that. Now, there are plenty of other things. If you go on the web and say, oh, this is wonderful moments, but if you go to just the things that we really know do some good, that's where you stop. So you can save money by doing that, by the way. Because again, every time they add something extra as a compound within a pill, they charge you another couple of cents or another couple of dollars or whatever. So again, my motto is to is to keep it simple and keep it down to a few things, and that should make a difference. But remember that you would notice a difference in in the first phases. And obviously, if you're not noticing any injury in the first couple of weeks, then you wouldn't be increased the dose and either some or more beetroot juice, or get the fork out and open the can of beetroot study or take take a bit more of the pills that if you if you go and pass probably 2 or 3 pills a day, you probably maxed out anyway. So stop at that level. So the effects are usually just you may get a little bit of loose bowels, or you may feel a bit bit nauseated. Otherwise it seems to be quite safe. But again, simple, not taking too much and taking it for X amount of time and all the all the rules of the supply or are meant to be applied for these sorts of things, it's worth, it's worth doing at that level. And the big thing about it, particularly from a food angle, is that the food's not going to do you any harm. So it's probably the simplest way webinar is just start with the food before you race for a pool.

40:52 S2

It's really fascinating because it talks about the fact that even if you take as a supplement, that gets to a point where it doesn't work anymore or it stops working, it's kind of interesting how the body kind of knows when when the right amount has been had. That's right.

41:05 S7

Yes. It's like, you know, you could chop up a glass to a certain point anymore. It flies, flies up or makes a mess and the, the, the wife or the partner gets shitty. But I'm going to clean that up.

41:17 S2

Yeah, yeah. I mean, you've been working this here all your life, but it's kind of fascinating how the the kind of body knows know knows what it wants and when it's had too much, it kind of rejects it in whatever way it chooses to.

41:28 S7

Yeah. Yeah. That's regarding we start with it may not know when before you start. Yeah. Yeah for sure. If we don't get it. Yeah. Can't see why the hell we need it. And they'll take it. Will never, never know will we. Yeah. If we take it and we do know there's an improvement within a short space of time. We'll also notice that there will be a levelling out, and an extra or more continuous work won't make a huge amount of difference, which is really why. Coming back to the third bit. This is one of the ones where there is some good and some good evidence that they work at this simplistic doses. So often they say, oh, you got to take this because it's got such and such a thing, but it's usually in such micro-doses. These are foods that I've just mentioned, are super cheap, available, and seem to work. So that's a good recipe. It's just those things alone.

42:23 S2

That I was speaking to Pam earlier this morning, and you've got a lovely beetroot and kale salad for dinner this afternoon, so enjoy it.

42:29 S7

Look, I think I've got to get on. I've got to go somewhere. I'm out of here. I'll take the dog for a walk.

42:38 S2

David, great to catch up. We'll speak again next month.

42:40 S7

All right. Bye, everyone.

42:41 S2

That's David Mitchell there with a bit of information and also a little bit of humor, which of course is very, very important for our health as well. Ah yes. Just what I feel like a nice, refreshing cup of tea. Thanks, Polly, for putting the kettle on. What's better than having a cup of tea? Speaking about it with Belinda from Brewed by Belinda the brew. That is true. 97, A old port road at Queenstown. Belinda, welcome. Thanks for catching up with us again.

43:25 S8

Hi, Peter. Thanks for having.

43:26 S2

Me. Yeah, actually, we should say before we talk about our topic of the day. Congratulations. You've received some fantastic news.

43:34 S8

Oh. Thank you. Yes we did. Each year we enter some of our teas into the Golden Leaf Awards, which is like an Industry t competition throughout Australasia. And yeah, we were, um, very lucky to receive, um, I think it was five gold and three silver medals for our two teas and tisanes. So yeah, really lovely. Just sort of acknowledgement of the work we do.

44:03 S2

I think Lucky's probably a little bit, uh, modest, but I guess it kind of, uh, affirms that, as I say, the work that you're doing, I know, having spoken to you for over two years now, we know about your, uh, sort of commitment to the environment and to the planet and also to your growers, how you have a very ethical standpoint when it comes to who you buy your tea from and how you prepare it, etc..

44:24 S8

Yeah, those values will never change. Um, since we started our well, I started this business almost ten years ago, those were things that were just really important to me. And yeah, I, um, love that our business is built on those kinds of values. And yeah, I know that they mean a lot to others as well. And that's why we have such a lovely customer base.

44:50 S2

That's a good way to put it. And that's a cool name for an award isn't it. The Golden Leaf Award I mean, it's very tea like, isn't it?

44:58 S8

It is, it is. No, it's, um, an amazing competition and, you know, it's judged there. All the teaser blind judged by professionals. And, um, yeah, it's great to be part of and really lovely to be acknowledged in that sort of context. Yeah. And I guess the.

45:15 S2

Sort of thing that, um, the industry would be, you know, what's the word? Not, not, not envious, but, you know, it'd be something that would be valued by the industry. And so kind of, uh, submitted to you to have a judge would be something that most people would like to do.

45:31 S8

Yeah, absolutely. I think it's, um, I think it's it's great. We love entering because we just want to always be really rigorous with what we're making and creating, and we want to know that we are making the best teas out there. And so we can stand by that. And yeah, that's why I enter, um, some teas each year. Is is just to, you know, make sure that we are, you know, still producing really beautiful teas.

45:59 S2

It's kind of almost like a quality assurance, isn't it? Someone kind of checking up that it's all still as good as it can be.

46:06 S8

Yeah. And you're not just plucking things.

46:10 S2

Hey, Brenda, you talked about your teas and your designs. Yeah. You've mentioned designs a few times over the time we've been speaking. What is the design or what are designs?

46:20 S8

Design is a French word. So what is a design? So a tisane is a infusion, sometimes called a herbal tea that includes, um, plants or, uh, includes ingredients that are not actual tea, so not a caffeinated tea brew. So. So we have the tea plant Camellia sinensis that's caffeinated, which we make tea with, and we make tea blends with. But we also then have a whole different sort of category of brews called tisanes that are that do not have caffeine and do not have the tea plant. So they're different in that they are usually made up of plant matter and mostly used for sort of some kind of medicinal or health benefit, but not always, but usually they will include, you know, herbs, peels, bark, petals and fruits and spices. So any kind of infusion or brew that doesn't have the Camellia sinensis plant is a herbal tisane. And these kinds of, um, Drinks have, you know, been used for centuries through all different cultures, you know, drinking these kind of plant potions, whether it's to warm or some kind of sacred blend or, um, some kind of, you know, health concoction. So, yes, it's been going on a long time throughout different cultures, but people.

47:57 S2

Today might see a herbalist or a naturopath. They might get a tablet or a drop if you like, a tincture or indeed capsules, etc. with herbs in it or different herbs in it, different combinations. So the design is kind of a bit of an extension of that. Or maybe it probably actually came first, isn't it? Then the the tablets and the capsules have sort of followed on to kind of make it a bit more manufactured.

48:19 S8

Yeah. Well that's it I guess. Um, you know, there are there are many different cultures that are sort of exploring this in different ways, whether that be sort of, um, you know, through Chinese medicine or Indian aviator and then, you know, countries like Germany have a long tradition of the therapeutic use of herbs or, you know, medicinal kind of products. And, um, yeah, this has been sort of going on for many, many centuries. And yeah, I guess it all just plays into this idea of, yeah, using herbs and plants to support health, whether that be, as you say, through tinctures and tablets and supplements or in a more sort of, I guess I would say, a gentler way through the infusion of, um, herbal tisanes.

49:05 S2

Because a lot of things also come in powders these days. You might mix it with smoothies, etc., but the tisane or the tea was there first. And I guess different combinations do different things as well. Or I guess you can almost, you know, make up your own recipe if you kind of wanted to. Absolutely.

49:19 S8

This is a really growing area of, you know, in the sort of health world health and wellness world. And, you know, there are different, you know, blends and mixtures that can, um, be functional in nature, that can help to like detox or calm and relax or help with sleep, or treat colds and flus or aid, um, digestion, things like that. Or you can just make, um, you know, brews that are sort of more about just deliciousness. So, you know, not sort of coming at it from that, um, necessarily a functional perspective, but just going, I want to make something delicious, or I want to make something refreshing in summer that can be iced or something uplifting in the afternoon when I hit a slump. So once you sort of have like a good knowledge of the different sort of ingredients and their benefits and their flavors and what they bring to a brew, you can really play and be creative. And that's what, you know, something we really love to do. Here are some of our blends do have that kind of functional aspect. And then others are, you know, really just for fun and creativity and deliciousness.

50:27 S2

Yeah. What about as far as the history goes? Because it does go back a long way. I mean, you know, uh, depending on how far back you want to go, like, there were times when, uh, witches were burnt at the stake for some of the things that they were providing and sort of some of the health claims they were making, but they've kind of survived the test of time, which I think is always a rather interesting indicator of how successful or how effective it might be.

50:49 S8

Yeah, this is it. There's just a long, long history that even predates written history of using, you know, plants for health and and pleasure. Um, and yeah, as I mentioned, many cultures have this sort of records of, of drinking these kind of plant potions. But yeah, it certainly is something that is very popular and used across the world. Um, yeah. Lots of different kind of important people through different, uh, countries that are sort of worked a lot in this area. Um, different herbalists. Um, yes. And yeah, it really does go back a long, long time. I know in one of my courses we studied a lot about sort of the German history. So they have a very long tradition of therapeutic use of herbs. And, you know, back like 1500 years ago, monks and nuns had been testing the effects of things on their bodies. So, yeah, lots of different researchers have discovered and advanced this whole area over time. And, um, yeah. And then there's to bring us to modern day, where, you know, the focus on health and wellness. It couldn't be more strong at the moment.

52:03 S2

And you're quite right, a lot of that kind of stuff or yes, a fair bit of that stuff does kind of have a bit of a spiritual background to it as well. You know, monks, as you say, some of the, the churches, etc.. Uh, there's a lot of, um, sort of depth in where that has come from as well.

52:19 S8

Absolutely. I think those, you know, lines that sort of cross between, yeah, health and wellness, but also Spirituality and meditation and different spiritual practices. Yeah, they they sort of go hand in hand T or t with spirituality. Yeah.

52:37 S2

Even things like burning incense. ET cetera. That sort of thing as well that, you know, often if you go to a health food shop, you might smell or even into a health natural health practitioner. They've got that sort of smell about it as well, which that sort of, um, uh, herbal, herbal smell. Yeah.

52:53 S8

I think these types of things just complement each other to create. I guess what we're all looking for is some, like, you know, sense of calm, whether that is through smell or taste, it's using our senses to find that inner calm that those places of sanctuary. Sanctuary. Um, yeah, I love incense, and I do use it a lot in home and at work to, um, you know, create a certain feeling. So, yeah, I think all of these, you know, things blend into one another for all round health and wellness goodness.

53:28 S2

So often Pam Mitchell, who's on this program, regularly talks about the hurry, hurry disease. We've all got that, haven't we? We kind of want to be doing what we need to do now. We want to do it yesterday. And that's kind of not not necessarily a healthy thing. Let's see.

53:40 S8

I think we are in a very interesting time. And I think it is very hard to, you know, really stand up against that. Um, all we can do is just, you know, keep reminding ourselves that, you know, we don't have to be going, you know, full bore all the time and that we can take these little moments to enjoy, you know, a healthy tea or create a little space for stillness.

54:04 S2

Well, thank you for creating a little space for us today to talk about that. Now, if people want to come and see you or get in touch with you, how can we find you?

54:10 S8

We are at our studio on Old Port Road in Queenstown. Otherwise through our website at Brewed by belinda.com. Or you can call us on 0419 839 702.

54:26 S2

Linda great to catch up. And again congratulations on those Golden Leaf Awards. Well deserved.

54:30 S8

Ah thanks Peter I appreciate it. Linda.

54:33 S2

Hello there from Brewed by Linda. If there's something you'd like Belinda to talk about in the area of tea or Tisanes, get in touch and we'll put Belinda to work.

54:42 S9

Hi, my name is Natalie Reid from Equality Lawyers and you're listening to leisure link with Peter Greco on the Vision Australia radio network.

54:53 UU

Listen, you better get a real good one.

54:58 S2

Always great catching up with the Human Services Minister and Minister for ageing as well. I think here in South Australia. Ageing well. Nat. Nat first time we've spoken this year. So happy new year. A little late I know. Yes.

55:09 S4

Happy New Year Peter. And listeners, now.

55:11 S2

That you're involved with this What's my Future program? I believe you were very, very much involved. Tell us a bit about it.

55:17 S4

Well, I think we need to do better as a community.

55:20 S10

Trying to ensure that we provide as many opportunities as we can for people with disability to engage in good paying jobs. I'll give you a little example in a minute of something I'm doing. But, um, also, we need to make sure we support the workforce supporting people with disability. So the launch of What's My Future happened last week. There was a bit of a seminar conference, um, happened here in Adelaide. But, look, it's a support worker recruitment campaign. We need to attract people who want to work in the space, people who are committed to work in the space, quality people to do quality work, and for whatever we can do to ensure that I think we should put in a lot of effort.

56:09 S2

You made a really good point. People who want to work in that area, rather than people who, you know, want a job.

56:15 S10

Yeah. That's right, that's right. I think Commonwealth have funded a, I National Colab workforce colliding, designing heaps of information on disability training and working opportunities. I think you'd remember, Peter, that we made a principled stand to do fee free TAFE and, um, try to encourage people who potentially wouldn't have been able to take up doing that training because they couldn't afford it. So I think we know that the workforce numbers are reasonably stable. Um, we've seen a rise, a little bit of an uptick in full time employment, but we know that the sector really does rely on casual workers, and there is quite a high turnover. So, um, let's try and get the right people who really want to work in this space, working in this space. And I think people with disability will tell you, once you have got a support worker that you can rely on, um, they are worth their weight in gold.

57:13 S2

Yeah, maybe even more than that. Now, what about the fair pay? Because that's very important as well. I mean, you can have people with a good heart, people that want to do it, people that love doing it. They're a passionate. They're also rewarded in other ways. But you've got to have you got to have food on your table.

57:27 S10

Yeah, absolutely. And we're currently going through that process now with our state disability support workers to negotiate fair pay deal with them. Of course, there are a range of different awards and agreements that are in place right across the sector to ensure people are getting fair pay. We in the public sector, we've got something, you know, like about 4 or 5 different agreements being negotiated at the moment. And our disability support workers are one of those.

58:02 S2

You were going to tell us about a paid job that you wanted to share? Oh, yeah. Yeah.

58:06 S10

Just just to say I, I, um, I won't give you too much information because I think we'll wait and see how this goes. But I have.

58:15 S2

Another exclusive that come on that.

58:18 S10

Busted out on on your show. Um, but look, I have and my my staff have taken some great care in preparing our workplace to employ somebody who has intellectual disability and making sure that we are safely able to support that person. And that person feels comfortable and confident to undertake their job. So, um, we I really feel strongly that, um, we need to do much better as a government employer of people with disability. And, um, you know, right across our public sector, we've got about, uh, you know, 100,000 workers. And we do have a target that's within our disability inclusion strategy, um, of getting 3%, um, employment levels of people with disability by the end of 2026. We'd love to, I think, get higher, but, um, we currently, um, you know, um, uh, somewhere, you know, officially and formally down at 1.34%. But but when we undertook a survey, we actually got a number back of 5.73%. So what that shows is that people might not necessarily identify as having disability when they first become employed. Um, but we do know that if if we survey people, we do get some honest results. And I'm pleased that that number is higher than that 3% target. So I think that's pretty good. But, um, my own office is making a real effort to ensure that we do better in that space. Well, I mean.

59:52 S2

Without being too flippant, you're the government. You should lead by example.

59:56 S10

I totally agree, you have to you the standard you know, you set, um, is very important as a government and you need to make sure that you are an exemplar in it. So, um, for whatever we can do to improve what we are doing, I think that's a good thing.

1:00:12 S2

I might just grab that little bit of recording and send it over to someone in America.

1:00:17 S10

Well, you know, disability is part of equity and inclusion. And when you think about people who are on the wrong measure of a lot of things, including employment, housing and, you know, living standards. So I think, uh, equity and inclusion is a very important part of our community. And I feel a bit sad that, um, it's being treated like a dirty word in other countries.

1:00:42 S4

Yes.

1:00:43 S2

It's an amazing what an executive order can do, and I don't want to go on about it too much now. But yeah, in a sense, the most upsetting thing about that was that some of the big corporates said, oh, well, we'll drop our, uh, equity inclusion plans as well. I mean, like we I mean, without wanting to sound like I've got a halo, like, where's their moral compass?

1:01:00 S10

Oh, they dropped it like a hot spud, didn't they? Like, it was like. Oh, great. I've just been waiting for an excuse to dump this nonsense. They said, but, um, you know, it's it's pretty awful, I reckon. And you know, I think there's, there's if you, if you don't sit and listen to people with lived experience that are diverse and have got sometimes some challenges. What a what a dull old life you'd lead, right.

1:01:23 S2

Well, who says you're better than me? Like you know you perfectly. But you know what I mean.

1:01:27 S10

Well I'm not.

1:01:28 S2

Well, what if you are? But they're bad examples.

1:01:32 S10

Yeah. Look, I it comes what brings to mind as well something that has gone into place, which I don't think people have picked up on, but people with disability parking challenges. One of the things that's changed recently through Parliament is that we pass legislation to expand the eligibility. Um, so there's a couple of things that need to happen. But, um, it means that people, including parents that might have a child, um, who is autistic. Um, where it's dangerous for them to walk across the car park and difficult to wrangle, you know, a couple of kids with some, you know, behaviour challenges or neurodiverse. We now have it so that they can apply for a parking permit, which brings us into line with other jurisdictions. And I think that is the sort of conversation that happens when you open yourself up as a government to communicating about diversity and inclusion, which we did when we went to to the community and said, how can we be better for people who are autistic and how can we be more inclusive? And this is one of the things that they said to us. And now we've responded. And so now we now people will have a more, you know, readily, readily accessible pathway to disability permits when they've got that sort of challenge in their life, which I think is a good thing.

1:02:46 S2

And an issue that is, of course, we need more parking spots.

1:02:50 S10

Bingo. So then it's down to sort of shop owners, property owners, councils, um, all to have a look around and go, well, what can we do to provide more car parks?

1:03:01 S2

So one of the things that obviously would be occupying your time with your both your, um, aging well hat and also your Human Services hat is the amount of people who are in hospital that could be in aged care facilities. What's the issue there? Are there not enough places in aged care for people to go? Is that people that have been in aged care go to hospital, then come out and their place has been taken. How come? Because it's not just people that are in hospital for a few days. Sometimes it's, you know, well, literally hundreds of days. Yeah.

1:03:31 S10

It's a bit of a wicked problem, isn't it? We've had good conversations before about transition to homes and, um, making our pathways and availability for people to transfer to who are NDIS participants when they no longer need the acute care, but they're waiting for, you know, home modifications or longer term housing? Well, SA health is doing something for older South Australians who are waiting for aged care. It's known as care of the older person and community transition. So COAG so that program is being run out of Hampstead and can support 50 people, and there is also now some hotel beds that people might have seen advertised or talked about in the media, where there can be some supported accommodation happening in hotels as well. But basically there are not enough nursing home or aged care beds. There are people who are still waiting far too long for home care packages. But the federal government did a great piece of work in the middle of last year getting their legislation through, which should activate a lot more of these places and packages. But it will take time, and the settings have to be right to incentivise the providers to invest in the building of those aged care beds. So this doesn't happen overnight, but it is one of those the best time to plant the tree, if it wasn't done ten years ago is now. And let me tell you, the tree certainly wasn't pine and ten years ago. So we are now catching up and we do need more beds, and the changes to that federal Aged Care Act will come into effect. And hopefully that will help more older people stay at home. And also we want to see investment in the system so we get more beds and we're going to need more because we have an ageing population and we know exponentially as the population grows, our actually the bracket of older people will grow faster here in South Australia. So we need to see us responding now. Yeah.

1:05:30 S2

Despite your youthful look, we're all getting older and that's one of the things that we've had on the program over the last few months has been the kind of review into music therapy and kind of its legitimacy. Have you got any thoughts about that?

1:05:43 S10

Well, last year, yes. So good quality therapy based on evidence. Absolutely. Um, has a place in our system. And last year I think there was some unforeseen consequences with a few changes that happened. And the previous minister for the NDIS, Bill shorten, sat down and talked with, for example, the Australian Music Therapy Association to discuss those concerns. And there has been a review kicked off into the delivery of the service, the quality of the service, the evidence around the service and that review has been finalised. I think the report is due in the next month or so, so that we can see good evidence based programs continue to be delivered by quality providers. Well, we.

1:06:27 S2

Spoke to a music therapist down in Tasmania who gave us a wonderful example of a young lad that came to see her with their support worker. And, you know, their hygiene wasn't as good. So they kind of came up with a music therapy, with some music, with some songs that he could then kind of, uh, you know, wash himself to and think, well, like, you need much more evidence than something like that. I mean, it's unique, but that's the whole thing about some of these therapies. They are a bit out of the box. It's not like your conventional way of thinking. And if music therapists have got that ability to kind of tap into that sort of ingenuity and they get results, for God's sake, just to prove it. Well, if.

1:07:04 S10

That's if that's, you know, again, like, I'm not aware of that individual circumstance, but, um, also the price has to be right and it has to be reasonable as well. So there is a whole range of things to be taken into account. But as I said, Minister Shorten had this raised with him, um, and did kick off this review into that particular set of therapies. And let's see what happens.

1:07:25 S2

That sometimes out of bad things, good things can come. I know late last year, I don't want to necessarily draw you on this, but where the situation where Prime Minister Albanese, uh, had a go at, uh, an opposition person about, you know, does he have Tourette's with his tick? I thought it was a really gutsy, courageous and noble thing of, uh, an ally to kind of pull it into line and say, hey, this isn't on. Yeah, she's.

1:07:50 S10

A pretty good operator. And. And I was with her last week having a good chat because she's now the assistant minister for disability. And yeah, it was good. And language does matter. And it matters about how we talk about people. I think often, you know, we we're all human and we do slip sometimes with a word here and there. And, and I'm always really conscious of trying to make sure I use the right language. But yeah, it lifelong habits are dangerous. Right. And you can sometimes let the words get in there. But it's the most important thing is that you pick it up, you correct it, you apologize for it, you move on and you do better next time. And I think this is where some of those really great campaigns, like the See Me for me campaign that we launched with DHS and, and the, um, report at right. Guidelines around portraying people with disability in the media are really, really important. So, um, people with Disability Australia, I think, developed a language guide and they've got some resources that they use. I think all of those things together, um, make for a much better conversation publicly. And I think the Prime Minister and Anna Lee, um, have talked about this publicly in the right way, and I think we're all making sure that we do better.

1:09:00 S2

Now I've gone over, as I always do. Thank you for your time. We'll catch up again soon.

1:09:04 S10

No worries. Thanks. Thanks, Peter. Have a good weekend and happy, warm, sunny days.

1:09:10 S2

Matt Cooke, the Minister for Human Services and Ageing. Well. With the wonderful news coming out of the Australia Day Awards, the Australian of the year awards, including an awarding of an Am to Samantha Connor for her wonderful work in the area of disability advocacy. Sam, welcome and congratulations. Thank you so.

1:09:32 S11

Much, Peter. It's lovely to be here again and talking to you.

1:09:35 S2

And I am.

1:09:36 S11

And I am. Yeah, it was a big surprise and usually difficult activists who are living in poverty and disabled women don't get fancy awards. And so I was quite surprised and also very grateful for the recognition. Well, they're.

1:09:49 S2

Probably the people that need it most or deserve it most. Yeah, I think so.

1:09:52 S11

I think a lot of the, um, awards go to people who are people who are a little bit richer than the rest of us and a little bit more fancy, and who probably don't swear as much. And yeah, it was lovely. Lovely to be recognised by my peers as well.

1:10:07 S2

I won't ask what your automatic reaction was because we might have to bleep that out.

1:10:12 S11

Absolutely.

1:10:14 S2

I'm always I'm always fascinated. What set you on this path? The sort of path of social justice, uh, wanting to do advocacy work because it can be thankless because you've kind of hinted at already.

1:10:25 S11

Yeah, yeah. So I think I have an innate sense of social justice because I'm autistic and we all do. You know, we have a very strong moral sense about what is right and what is wrong. And, you know, sometimes they're a little bit too black and white. But in this case, it's a good thing that, you know, we know what human rights look like and disability rights. And we have very clear blueprints about what that looks like with the uncrpd. So when I was a little kid, I was 11, and my best friend was shot in the back of the neck and became a quadriplegic and a little later on went to had to go and live in an institution and there was no funding. This is 1979. Mind you, I'm quite old. No funding, no anything. And yeah, so it was quite a wake up for me about disadvantage and what it looked like for disabled people. And I wasn't a wheelchair user until years later. Um, but yeah. So it, um, opened my eyes to what injustice looked like. And I guess that's where I started.

1:11:18 S2

So that's, uh, you know, 40 something years ago. We've come a long way. There's a long way to go, too.

1:11:23 S11

Yeah, yeah. And I think there's been some steps back along the way recently. We still are working, you know, to fight against those things. But, um, obviously the world has had some great disruptions over the last five years and things have changed in terms of money and, you know, what our budget looks like and that kind of thing, and also people's perception around disability as well. Um, but we keep fighting for, you know, for recognition and to make sure we've always got a seat at the table.

1:11:50 S2

I know, having spoken to you for a few times as president of People with Disabilities Australia, you're meeting with politicians, you're meeting with, I was going to say high rollers. That's probably not quite right. But, you know, people of influence. You know, you've got to kind of get your message across pretty quickly in meetings like that, don't you?

1:12:07 S11

You do. And it's quite a knack to it really. After, you know, when you're going and talking to people of all different, um, you know, persuasions, I guess, you know, um, obviously, you know, as a disability activist, I'm a bleeding heart lefty, but you have to work with both sides of politics. But disability is a bit weird, and it's kind of good in that way that you might have, you know, lots of disabled people have got concerns about euthanasia laws. You know, that they they might not be against euthanasia, you know, but they might be against, you know, not being getting the support to live before you can get the support to die, for example, you know, so they want those issues. And so we're quite often on the side of the right wing politicians. So you know, and it really is a bit of a thing. You know, I have a meeting with, um, Malcolm Roberts, and he was very deliberately inflammatory towards me and my colleague. But, you know, I come from a small country town and, you know, you talk about small businesses and farmers and whatever, and it's really about finding the things that you have in common. And everybody has something in common with another human being. And so, yeah, we should all be able to work together.

1:13:10 S2

That's a great way to put it. Now, I guess, you know, because I always, you know, I often say to people, you know, people sort of say NDIS wa wa wa. I say, well, everyone is potentially but a heartbeat away from, you know, potentially having to be on it. Yeah that's.

1:13:23 S11

Right. And if you develop a bit of a relationship with people over something before you have a war with them, you know, in the country you're quite often more likely to, you know, to meet your neighbour when, um, I don't know, the sheep gets out or something, you know, like, rather than you need to borrow a chainsaw. Like it's not you don't go over and meet someone over a cup of tea and start talking about politics. And so in online spaces and political spaces, your first meeting with someone is about something really controversial, and you don't have time to build a relationship with people. But I don't know, just finding out if people have a cat is always a good start.

1:14:00 S2

I find. Okay.

1:14:01 S11

Photos of your cat or your dog on your phone. Um, yeah.

1:14:04 S2

Well, make a connection.

1:14:05 S11

Yeah, yeah. So yeah. And you know, even even though we say to people, look, you could have a child with a disability, you could break your neck, you could be an NDIS participant at any time. People. I think they really need that connection before that so that they'll listen to you because, um, and know that you're a reasonable and decent human being, so you can have the conversation in the first place. That makes sense.

1:14:26 S2

Sure. Sam, what about coming up early, early in March? We've got International Women's Day. Have you got some thoughts about that? Because I've spoken to some women who kind of think it's still or it is even more tokenistic than ever, in a sense, and they kind of don't want much to do with it.

1:14:43 S11

Yeah. And I kind of, um. Look, I don't boycott it. Um, I don't go to International Women's Day events because a lot of the issues that they're lobbying around, you know, disabled people, disabled women face so much more disadvantage, you know. And so when we talk about the rates of violence, the unemployment rates, the glass ceiling issues, you know, so we're talking about the glass ceiling issues and, um, things about merit based employment. And it's still legal to pay women with disabilities two bucks an hour in Australia. So one of the Royal Commission recommendations was that it should be raised to the minimum wage of every other Australian, and the Australian government have come back and said, oh, we'll make it half the minimum wage. So that's still legal today in 2025 that I can go and be employed down the road in a sheltered workshop and get two bucks an hour. So sitting at those tables with other women, especially white women and privileged women, you know, for Aboriginal women as well, it's the same deal We find that we we have deeper and bigger issues, and the things that they're talking about quite often are kind of, you know, sexism lite or, you know, so it's and it's a little bit difficult because when you talk about it in women's spaces, they say, well, that's not an issue around women, that's an issue around disability. But it's not, you know, so it's a really tricky thing to try and navigate those spaces.

1:16:05 S2

Well that's, that's that's very deep isn't it. And we haven't got enough time to kind of pursue that further. But that that is quite an incredible way of looking at it.

1:16:13 S11

The last time I went to one, they said, um, there's a door prize and if you reach under your chair, you'll be able to pull out an envelope. And if it's got this golden ticket in, then you'll get the door prize. And of course, I was sitting in a wheelchair, so I cracked up laughing. And I thought, this is such a good analogy. Yeah, we left out.

1:16:31 S2

Yeah, yeah. Like, yeah, totally innocent, but still very, very powerful. The mistake that they made.

1:16:37 S5

Yeah, it was.

1:16:38 S11

Just funny. But, um, I thought, look, this is a waste of time. I'd much rather be in a space where, you know, we can make real change for women. But I think it's about making sure that people do literally have the same opportunities that people that women with disabilities do. Have a seat at the table. One of our elders, Glenda Lee, died on Saturday. Um, great loss to our community. And, um, you know, my International Women's Day is going to be making as much noise and as many DDA complaints and making as much trouble as I can in honour of Glenda.

1:17:10 S2

They can't take your aim away now, anyway, can they? So you can do whatever you like.

1:17:13 S5

I wish I could be one of the first ones. Yeah.

1:17:17 S2

Well, I guess they'll probably get more published than the original. Getting it?

1:17:20 S5

Absolutely. You certainly know.

1:17:21 S2

How to make a splash. I said 1979. Who were some of the people that influenced you that kind of set you on this path? Because I'm sure you were doing that. You know, pretty much. Well, literally as we speak.

1:17:32 S5

Yeah, absolutely.

1:17:34 S11

Um, Glenda was one of, you know, the early elders for me, and it made me very aware. You know, she's only ten years older than me, but was considered to be an elder in our community. And, um, you know, really, the disability rights fight is such a long, arduous, you know, lengthy, um, fight that it really extends over more than one lifetime. And so the progress is very slow, but it's also very rewarding, you know, because it takes more and it's harder to do. But at the same time, we need to make sure that we're, um, including young people with disability handing on the baton. Next week, we've got a free activist course called Crip College that there's a few hundred disabled people enrolled in, and we're teaching them, you know, about the historical history of disability in Australia and how to make change. And you know what, what change looks like in Australia. And so, yeah, that's something that's really exciting. So I'm really aware that, you know, as in my late 50s, that I'm, you know, need to be doing that work like Glenda did. And um, yeah, I think a lot of older women are in the same boat.

1:18:35 S2

We never have enough time. Congratulations again. and I am I. You turn me a little story before coming to her about how you can use your Am now as part of your name.

1:18:43 S11

I can. So my name is Sam, so I can just use a small S and a capital A and a capital M I haven't quite got used to putting an Am after my whole name, because it seems to be a little bit proper. So, um, I'm sure we'll get used to it at some point, but at the moment it's just a little bit funny that I can incorporate it.

1:19:00 S2

Yeah. Again, congratulations. Richly deserved. I'm looking forward to hearing how you go when you get to government House, but we might have to get you back to talk about that because that'll probably be worth the interview as well I reckon.

1:19:10 S5

Yeah, absolutely.

1:19:12 S11

Thanks so much for having me.

1:19:14 S2

That's a winner. A recipient, a very richly deserved recipient of an I am Samantha Connor on the East Australia Network through your favorite podcast service on 1190 7 a.m. in Adelaide, you're listening to Leisure Link. A really interesting campaign was launched just this week. Let's find out a bit more about and speak to one of the people involved here. Boniface, you're lovely to catch up with you again. Thank you for your time.

1:19:41 S5

No worries.

1:19:41 S12

Peter, thank you for having me here.

1:19:43 S2

Yeah, this sounds really exciting. Uh, saying that, uh, for potential people to work in the disability area.

1:19:49 S8

Absolutely. Yep. So it's an.

1:19:51 S12

Attraction and retention campaign. Um, we want to have skilled, confident and competent people, uh, supporting people with disability.

1:20:00 S2

They had some kind of heavy hitters. If I could be impolite to launch it. Uh, the minister and the assistant minister and the South Australian Human Services minister are all involved.

1:20:10 S12

Yeah, absolutely. Um, so, yeah, it was amazing to have such support for our campaign. We're a very eclectic bunch. We're made up of just, um, people who have come together really passionate to make a change in this area.

1:20:25 S5

I was going to ask.

1:20:25 S2

You why this happened, but I guess it's kind of obvious, isn't it? I mean, there's probably many, many reasons why something like this has happened.

1:20:31 S12

Yeah, yeah, mainly, um, we've been doing this work since March 2023, and what we heard is that people with disability aren't always being able to access the support that they need, when and where they need it, and of course, that's greatly impacting on their lives. And so we were determined to come together to try and showcase the rich and rewarding career that disability support work can be, and the amazing difference that people can make in people's lives with disability.

1:21:02 S5

Is that kind.

1:21:02 S2

Of the appeal, if you like. I mean, you said rich and rewarding. You're probably not thinking bank account wise, though, are you in a sense?

1:21:10 S12

Well, you know, it can be. It definitely can be. But what we really want to showcase is that, you know, there's just so much diversity with the type of work that you could be doing and the huge range of people that you could be supporting that no two days, you know, are the same. No, sometimes no two hours are the same. So yeah, it can appeal to so many people, and there's such rich, transferable skills that you can learn in this work and that you can take, you know, to any, any kind of area in life with you. So, yeah, we really want to showcase the beauty of this work.

1:21:46 S2

That's a really important point about the variety and also like the different areas. I mean, if someone's kind of interested in the recreational side of life, they can put it that way. There's an opportunity there.

1:21:56 S12

Absolutely. And one of our people who have been part of this group since the start is, you know, a professional Olympic surfer. And so her support workers absolutely need to love the outdoors, need to be up for a very active, you know, lifestyle to help support that person and what they would like to do and how they want to live their lives here.

1:22:18 S2

And with something like that, of course, the success of the individual kind of rubs off on the support staff, if I can put it that way.

1:22:24 S12

Definitely. And we heard that yesterday at the launch, you know, it's such a reciprocal relationship and that's what makes it so rich and rewarding as well, is those, you know, deeply personal and empowering relationships for both people.

1:22:38 S2

So you talked about an eclectic bunch, which is a very good thing. What about as far as kind of the the union side of things? So I guess that's very important as well as part of, uh, sort of fair conditions and fair pay.

1:22:50 S12

Absolutely. And so the union are such a rich resource in the sense of that they represent so many members that they can really highlight those areas that need to change. Um, and also have such great ideas on how they can be changed because they hear from so many people about, you know, those barriers to retaining, uh, people within the sector as well. And so that's where we can start to really drive and advocate for change.

1:23:16 S2

That retaining is important as well, because sometimes it's well and good to attract people. But then if it's not the sort of thing that, you know, you need something to keep them there. And that's part of the campaign as well.

1:23:28 S12

Absolutely. And you know, what we heard overwhelmingly was that people don't really understand what it is. And so what we've really tried to showcase through interviewing people with disability and their support workers is what it could look like. And so that we're trying to really broaden that lens of people's understanding and appreciation for disability support workers.

1:23:48 S2

What about getting people on the way to this? I'm thinking in terms of training courses, that sort of thing. Yes.

1:23:55 S12

And thank you for mentioning that, Peter. What we heard when we were doing our research for the campaign was that it was really hard for people to access information because different states and territories require different things. And so as part of the website, we've developed a jurisdictional map. You can just click on your area and find out about events that are happening near you. If you'd like more information. Want to talk directly with some people who are already in the profession, but also around training, you know, police checks, clearances, etc. that you may need as well as advocacy services. So people don't feel that they're alone in this if they are experiencing some of the negative side of, you know, things as well. So there are lots of things out there that people can access through the website.

1:24:43 S2

Yeah, for sure. It's a little bit amusing, isn't it? Like we're one country, but states and territories and different little idiosyncrasies from different states about different things. It's it's kind of well, it kind of can be very amusing, but also very frustrating. I think as far as the sort of the, the red tape things, uh, go.

1:25:02 S12

Absolutely. That's. Yeah, that's what we're trying to overcome as well. Yeah. Some of those barriers so that people can access relevant, uh, and, you know, really accessible information.

1:25:13 S5

What about kind.

1:25:14 S2

Of targeting people who might you know, I've had enough of doing this desk job. I've had enough of, uh, whatever job it might be. I want to change kind of, you know, maybe sort of a if you like, a more mature rage, or someone that might want a change of career, that sort of approach.

1:25:29 S12

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, that's the beauty of disability support work. There's so many people that you could be supporting, you know, that cover all ages, all cultural backgrounds, religious backgrounds, etc., that there's actually something for everybody. You know, you can really have that strong compatibility piece. But also we find that what people are really looking for in their support workers are, above all things like empathy. You know, the ability to listen. And sometimes, you know, people with a with that experience really understand those core kind of values and skills that would make a brilliant support worker.

1:26:06 S2

Well, along those lines, what about people with disabilities themselves working in this sort of area?

1:26:10 S5

Absolutely.

1:26:11 S12

And that's something that we really want to promote. You know, there's just so much breadth within this work that it's a really underutilized and under-resourced area that we really want to showcase and highlight as well. People in our campaign work as mentors to other people with disability, you know, and things like that. There is nothing, you know, no one that kind of couldn't look into doing this work.

1:26:38 S2

I talked about Amanda Rishworth getting involved and Ali Nat Cook. I mean, it's good to have that sort of, uh, buy in, if I can put it that way.

1:26:46 S12

Absolutely. And I think, um, you know, this has been a real, true collaboration. The same core group of people have been influencing it from the start, um, since March 2023. And at the heart of everything that we've done is people with disability having a really strong voice around what's important to them. And I think that that's, you know, part of the beauty of the campaign, but also that provides those really rich insights into what's needed to kind of transform this sector as well.

1:27:17 S2

I spoke to Nat Cook a number of times on this program over a number of years, actually. Now, Sharon, I think one thing you can say about that. Well, two things. She's very, very passionate and she's very, very genuine. What you see is what you get. And I get a chance to speak to our guest off air and kind of communicate with them off air. So you kind of get a bit of an idea of what they're really like, not just what they say on air. And and as I say, that is very, very genuine about her wanting to to make a difference.

1:27:45 S5

Absolutely.

1:27:46 S12

100% agree with that, Peter. Yeah. Very, very authentic.

1:27:51 S2

Authentic. That's a great word. So what from here then? Uh, you've got a website up and running.

1:27:56 S12

We have got a website up and running. Um, part of our work as well is building or looking at how we build a career path for workers. Like what you touched on before, Peter, around better conditions, um, you know, improved salaries, etc. and also around training. So the need to address differently trained workers depending on the people that you're supporting. So not everyone comes out with those skills that help support people with high and complex needs, that that's a different skill sets that is required. Um, and the exciting thing about that is also involving people with disability to make those decisions around the training reform. So yeah, we've still got a lot to a lot to do. But also, um, the website will be constantly evolving. So if anyone wants to get involved, you know, we're really keen to make sure that people with disability and their support workers are really represented in what disability support work could look like. And the really amazing difference that you can make in somebody's life. And so, yeah, if anyone's keen to be involved in doing those interviews, we'd be more than happy to come and record those with people as well.

1:29:07 S5

Where do we.

1:29:07 S2

Go? What's the.

1:29:08 S5

Website?

1:29:08 S12

The website is what's my Future?

1:29:11 S2

Com.au so we'll put that up with our show notes. Cheryl. Always great to catch up. Lovely to speak to you again. Congratulations on the initiative. Two years to get to this point. Be good to catch up. Well, probably for two years time, but in two years time to see where it all goes. Because it's kind of a a working document, a live document. I'm sure a lot will change between now and then. One thing that won't change, I'm sure, is the demand for people to work in this area, that there will always be a job in this area, won't there?

1:29:37 S5

Absolutely, absolutely.

1:29:38 S12

100% there will be.

1:29:40 S5

Yeah.

1:29:40 S2

So great to catch up. We'll speak again soon.

1:29:42 S12

Thank you so much.

1:29:43 S5

Peter, this is Cheryl Boniface.

1:29:45 S2

That's a very important launch during the week. And we'll put those details up with our show notes. But if you or someone you know maybe is looking for a career change, or maybe would like to just get more out of their job, check that out. And if you ever have trouble with our show notes or our website, you can always give us a call here at the radio station. 1300 847 406. A couple of quotes before we go. What kind of quotes? Mark sends one through. Mark says, My niece in Redlands in New South Wales goes to school there. Their motto is with heart. Do everything with heart. Do everything with a good heart. Mark, thanks so much for that. And also one from Brian who sends his quote through. Brian says what was right yesterday may have changed entirely tomorrow. Brian, thank you very much for your quote. Some birthdays before we go. Louis Bishop having a birthday, one of our fine Paralympians. Also a great. Happy birthday to Jack Howes and Raissa Martin having a birthday. One of our gold ballers, the Gold Ballers have had birthdays lately. Happy birthday to you and Joe Connelly having a birthday, Joe. A very huge, big thank you and happy birthday for all the wonderful work you do in the community. I think Joe's celebrating 25 years since working or beginning work in the disability sector. Joe Connelly, A very happy birthday to you. May long may you Endure. That's it for the program. Sam, Richard, thanks so much for your help. Pam Green, thanks so much for yours. Reminding you that Leisure Link is available on your favorite podcast platform. If you like the program, be a bit like Frank Sinatra. Start spreading the news. Tell more people about it. Speaking about spreading the news coming up very soon, Vicki Cousins is here with Australian Geographic. So if you're listening through 1190 7 a.m. in Adelaide, stay tuned for that. In the meantime, be kind to yourselves, be thoughtful and look out for others all being well. Let's look back at the same time next week on Vision Australia Radio. This is leisure link.