Inclusion, survival, transactions and dating

00:05 Rachel

Hi, I'm Rachel Watson, I am three time Paralympian, two time gold medalist and two time bronze medalist. And you're listening to Leisure Link with Peter Greco on the Vision Australia Radio network.

00:39 Peter

It's just gone 5:00 - and with live golf in Adelaide at the moment, we channel a bit of Happy Gilmore and Berry Gordy and Jamie Bradford and Money. That's what I want! Now, actually, more important than money.... I'd love you to allow me to welcome you to the Leisure Link here on [Vision] Australia Radio 1197 in Adelaide, online at varadio, Radio Digital in Adelaide and Darwin through the TuneIn radio app for Vision Australia Radio Adelaide... our friends listening through Hope FM in Esperance in Western Australia, 103.9 over there, and of course also Disability Media Australia - they support us as well. You can find out more about them, including on Powerd Media, POWERD. 

Peter Greco saying fabulous to be here. Thank you for your company. This program comes to you from Kaurna land - and coming to you very, very shortly, we'll talk to Rachel Watson OAM about Paris and some really exciting news regarding future Paralympians. We'll talk cricket with Trevor Smith, we'll talk tennis with Ben Dew...  Pam Mitchell will join us, our resident counsellor, talking about some of the recent disasters and how do people recover from that. Heidi Girolamo will also join us, the Shadow Minister for Education and other shadow portfolios. We'll have a chat to Heidi about how that's all coming along. Jason Bryce from Welcome Cash will join us to talk about mandated cash. What does it really mean? 

And also, we'll catch up with Katy Hammond from Spinal Life Australia to talk about disability and dating, especially after Valentine's Day. Katie's got some tips for you. Maybe you will find some summer love. Well, it's always great catching up with our famous Paralympians. And certainly Rachel Watson OAM is one of those. Rachel, great to speak to you again and thanks for your time.

02:36 Rachel

Thanks for having me Peter. It's great to be here.

02:39 Peter

How was Paris for you? I know we spoke to you before going away. How did it turn out?

02:43 Rachel

Yeah, it was pretty good. I was very lucky to come away with two bronze medals. So I got a bronze in the 50 metre freestyle and the 100 metre freestyle. It was a very tight turnaround, only 48 hours. So unfortunately, I couldn't go a little bit quicker and get the gold again, but overall, I'm just really proud to have made the podium again for three consecutive games.

03:08 Peter

Yeah, that's a fantastic achievement. Now, I remember vividly speaking to you before the games, and you explained very clearly and very articulately about the sort of change in classification, etc., and how you might be... well, shall we say, having to, you know, almost swim outside your classification to do well in Paris. So final result, you'd be very pleased with that.

03:30 Rachel

Oh, definitely. Yeah. Look, it's always hard for me to swim up a classification. Never ideal. But to make the podium is something that you really... cherish. Especially when you know the chances of you actually getting a medal in an event where you're swimming. Classification above you is is far less so. You know, it's always great to have good competition. And if anything, it pushes you pushes you more when people are faster than you. So... very good results in the end.

04:03 Peter

Yeah. I remember you speaking to us and thinking, Oh, you know, maybe you were playing your chances down, but, I mean, you know, it's a real difference, isn't it, for for those of us that maybe don't totally understand it. No, it's... as I say, it's a real difference. A very palpable difference.

04:19 Rachel

Yeah, definitely. In my race, it was a couple of girls that could kick. Some of them could sit up unaided, you know, so they had a lot more function than me. But what I really had to do is just use the function that I've got and try to use it to the best ability, and you can't really get caught up too much in what others can do or what you can't do. You've kind of got to try and use it as a bit of a power to you and go, Where else can I get strong? You know, and really just leave it in the pool and make sure that you've given it 100%.

04:55 Peter

And you'd... be very satisfied after that because that's what happened.

04:58 Rachel

Yeah. Very happy.

04:59 Peter

What about the overall games themselves? Of course. You went to Tokyo. We all know about COVID. I hate even mentioning it, you know, three years later or whatever. But the sort of events and the sort of whole hoopla of Paris, how did you find that?

05:11 Rachel

Yeah, it was really good. You know, the the French people really tried to put on a good Games. So we were very accommodating, very, very enthusiastic as well to have a say. And really, it was just about the magic becoming alive again. You know, we we didn't really get that with Tokyo because it was this COVID bubble. There was still COVID in the village in Paris.

05:34 Peter

Really?

05:35 Rachel

Yeah. Yeah, there was unfortunately. So people again, probably mingling too much, you know.

05:43 Peter

But you know what I mean.

05:44 Rachel

Oh, yeah. No, look, they were really enjoying that. It was just a free space. You know, we, so we did say in the village some athletes were positive during their race. So we still took COVID-safe precautions for Team Australia, but we still had a lot more freedom to walk around, sightsee around the village. You know, there wasn't any external sightseeing, but we just got to feel like a community again and really embrace it. We're all together as Paralympians, and we're there because we're good at what we do and we love what we do, and we didn't have to worry about missing out on that at this time.

06:28 Peter

You're one of the most senior athletes now. You've been around for a little while, so I guess you can be objective. It was a fairly small team we sent overall. Do you think our performances were pretty good given the numbers that we took away?

06:40 Rachel

Look, yes and no. We had some good performances. Really solid... and potentially some of them were expected. We expected good things from them. Others were surprising. And, you know, we were really happy for them. We had some people who didn't perform at their best. And then unfortunately, we had people who came in and, you know, they won a medal in Tokyo and they came away from this game with with no medals. So I think it just shows you that sometimes everyone's individual preparation, it gives them a lot to reflect on. 

But the other thing is, sometimes we don't have a lot of race experience in Australia that we can try to think about, you know, what is the rest of the world doing? Because we all we can do is time trials, whereas the rest of the world often are able to do more traveling, more touring race against each other. So I think given what we have in Australia, we did very well as a Paralympic team and there's always positives as well as negatives, but I think now is the time to reflect and be thankful for, you know, the opportunity, but to also be ready to learn from it as well.

07:54 Peter

Very best way to... kind of along those lines and maybe looking to the future rather than reflecting. You were in a rather interesting launch the other day.

08:02 Rachel

Yeah. That was really... groundbreaking. It hasn't been done before. So Australia really want to be at the forefront of Paralympic sports. So every state is now launching a Para Sport Unit. So the Queensland Academy of Sport launched theirs just a few days ago. And it's really a chance for us to have a hub, a hub where everyone in that area is all together. They are learning about Paralympic sport or what they've got the experience of it, and it means that other athletes and staff can come into this space. And we're not having to be the guinea pig where someone's learning, you know, out of us. We are able to go there and we've got that expertise in one space. 

It's also about trying to bridge the gap of who is actually participating in Paralympic sport. We know there's a lot of barriers out there, and one of the reasons that people don't do Paralympic sport is it's just not accessible to them. They can't physically get there. They don't have the coaching staff that are available and that are okay with coaching disability. They don't have the venues. They don't have all the support crew. So this is going to be a big avenue of breaking down that barrier and going. We actually, now we don't have a barrier. 

And if you can't get out to us, we can come to you. We can come to your program, to your coach, give you some mentoring, check in with you every couple of months, you know, so that if you're not in Brisbane or one of those main areas, then we I guess it's now giving people an option to know that it's still possible. We're trying to trying to target regional and rural community. It's really going to be hopefully the secret weapon to success for '32.

09:53 Peter

And of course, being from Queensland, that is very much a a big state, isn't it? So there's a lot of people that don't live in Brisbane in some of the other big cities. A lot of people do live in those cities, but uh, Queensland's pretty spread out as far as population goes and obviously people with disabilities and athletes with disabilities.

10:10 Rachel

Well, it's very spread out and that is good and bad because it means potentially we're missing people. We don't want to miss anyone. We don't want anyone missing out. But if we don't know they're out there and they don't know that we're there as a service, then unfortunately, we're going to be too far apart. So hopefully through, you know, media and other channels, it can really get the word out there. And even if it's, you know, a video link up to get someone on track ready for their aspirations, it's really going to open the open the door to to a lot of people, but we've got to make that start. So that's what, a couple of days ago. That's what the announcement was saying, that it's a start and it's going to grow and come with day two. Hopefully we see a lot of success from that.

10:59 Peter

What about your role in it, Rachel, any thoughts about that?

11:02 S1

So my role in it, I'm more just I guess like an athlete ambassador at the moment. Um, there's no sort of formal role or paid role in it at the moment. They just using the staff that are currently in the system are to deliver it and everything, but hopefully come, you know, maybe even 2026. We see people like me who have more of an active role in the power of sport unit, so that people who are aspiring, they can actually see that this is someone living and breathing, doing it right now, and it gives them that motivation which they need.

11:39 Peter

Because I'm sure it's not just me, but you are a very impressive individual when you speak and obviously the way you perform that, I think you know, those talents apart from obviously your swimming talents shouldn't go, shouldn't go, you know, shouldn't go missing or shouldn't be recognised. And I'm not trying to tell them, tell them who should be getting jobs or not, but you know what I mean. I think you'd be the the perfect fit for a role in an organisation like that or in a setup like that.

12:04 Rachel

Yeah. And I think you I definitely do want to be involved. We had the launch, you know, a few days ago, but it's not actually being, I guess, implemented into March so that he did the official launch to, you know, get the excitement and and everything. But we don't actually start running the unit until March. So it'll be very interesting to see how over the next six months, how it grows, what service delivery model it follows, what else is needed in the para sport unit space? Where are the gaps? And hopefully they approach current Paralympians for some sort of role in the unit, because I think the best sort of people who can help with this sort of thing are people who are living and breathing it.

12:51 Peter

Yeah, well, I keep saying it just about with any interview I do, it's all about lived experience and you certainly have that. So it's probably going to look a lot different. It's going to look a lot different in three, five, you know, eight years time or what are we you know what actually it's only seven years to Brisbane isn't it? I went past it, but it's going to look a lot different in the next little while.

13:10 Rachel

Well, I hope it does. You know, if it doesn't, it means I think we've failed in the Para Sport space. So I really do want to see that we've got targets to follow, and we're just breaking down every barrier so that everyone can see that there are people out there who are living the same dream that they aspire to.

13:31 Peter

Right. Sure. Great to catch up. I, I'm sure that higher honours await you. Apart from being a Paralympic gold medallist, I think you've got a very bright career in... almost whatever you choose to do. Whatever it is, we'd love to keep in touch - and thank you for speaking to us.

13:43 Rachel

Thank you so much, Peter. That was great. And yeah, I'd love for you to continue to follow my journey and see where it takes me.

13:50 Peter

I'm going to. Put me down as a referee anywhere along the line. Rachel, you know where I am.

13:53 Rachel

Oh, amazing. Thank you. And you know I'm happy.

13:58 Peter

I might... need you more than you need me.

14:01 Rachel

That's all right. That's all right. More than happy to help, Peter.

14:04 Peter

Terrific. All the best, Rachel.

14:06 Rachel

Thank you so much.

14:07 Peter

Rachel Watson there, OAM, a couple of gold medals and a couple of Paralympic bronze medals in Paris. And certainly, personally, with a very bright career ahead of her. Regardless of what career Rachel chooses.

The Director of Cricket inclusion Championships have wrapped up for another year. Let's find out, particularly from the South Australian perspective, how our team for athletes with intellectual disability went. And speak to our manager, Trevor Smith. How ya goin' Trev? Good to catch up again.

14:36 Trevor

Yep. Likewise, Peter. Always good to catch up with you.

14:38 Peter

How'd it go?

14:39 Trevor

Oh, yeah, it went very, very well. We fell at the final hurdle and got beaten by a very good Victorian team in the in the grand final, but... the boys performed admirably and...  exceptionally well all week in hot conditions.

14:54 Peter

It was spoken a bit about the conditions, though. They weren't great, and also a little bit of rain kind of interfering with play as well.

15:00 Trevor

Yep. The week prior, they or in the buildup to the championships, they had an enormous amount of rain and... it sort of curtailed the first day's play against... Queensland. So we couldn't play Queensland. And then we opened up against... Victoria, in the minor rounds.

15:19 Peter

Bit of a baptism of fire in the first game against Victoria.

15:22 Trevor

Yeah, we managed to ball them all out for 57, though, which we were absolutely rapt with.

15:27 Peter

Yeah, maybe that was... you know, one match too soon. Trevor, who stays out for the final?

15:33 Trevor

Could have, absolutely could have been. I mean, the boys were were totally charged and they came out of the traps really well... and, you know, throughout the week, there was stunning displays from... you know, all the team, all the team contributed.

15:47 Peter

What about the kind of concept of the NCIC? I know we've spoken about it before, but from your point of view and a manager's point of view, do you think it's a good idea, the sort of three competitions all being played at the same time in the same state?

16:00 Trevor

Yeah, it's... moved on from when we were in Geelong where we were all at different grounds. Now we're all at... the same sort of... area at Marchant Park. The difficulty is we, you know, you still don't get much time to... watch the other teams, unfortunately. And obviously, you're... immersed in your, in your own... environment, I guess, and... making sure the lads are hydrating properly in those conditions and taking on board the right food.

16:27 Peter

Yeah. I mean, that's something that this really kind of, Oh, maybe... I'm a bit wrong, but kind of improved over the over the last few years has been the kind of way the... players are treated in terms of... elite athletes and sort of coaching and guidance and mentoring along the way of... the best way to look after themselves in terms of preparation and as you say, after the game as well.

16:47 Trevor

Absolutely. Soccer have been absolutely fantastic, both with Jason, the coach and I and also the squad... giving them opportunities to meet with former players such as Mark Cosgrove and Philippa Phillips and, and tap into their sort of... knowledge and experiences of actually going away and what the best preparations and after match... warm downs. 

17:13 Peter

Which was going to be a bit of a buzz for the players, wouldn't it, you know, have... rubbing shoulders and getting advice, chatting to, people like... Cozy and Flipper?

17:20 Trevor

Yeah, absolutely. And then Sakura also arranged for... the deaf to play against a Lord's Taverners on Adelaide Oval, for the blind and low vision to play a parliamentary eleven on Adelaide Oval and for ourselves to play a SA eleven on Adelaide Oval.

17:38 Peter

What was that like for you guys when you spoke to... we spoke to Brad Breida from Blind Cricket, and we actually spoke to Leon Bignell, the Speaker of the House, who played blind cricket. And. Well, I mean, I'm sure he wasn't putting his political speak on. He sounded like he had a fantastic day. And I guess to be on the other oval, I mean, you know, you can't kind of can't beat that, can you?

17:57 Trevor

No, it was it was an absolute fabulous day. And and again, thanks to SACA, and in particular Joe Connelly, for organisational skills and, and the whole SACA for... supporting people with disability, being able to play on the Adelaide Oval. We narrowly lost to a good SA Police side and you know, both teams really went for it and really enjoyed it as well.

18:21 Peter

That's a great thing isn't it. And it kind of cool that, I guess, you know, from the SA police point of view, it's kind of a bit of an education for them as well to kind of get to find out about about people with disabilities and the things they can do as well as, you know, maybe some of the challenges that they may have.

18:36 Trevor

Absolutely. And, you know, the camaraderie afterwards and the afterwards. And... I found that... a number of... the support team were actually following our... progress online and through... Frog Box, over in... Brisbane.

18:53 Peter

That's fantastic, isn't it?

18:54 Trevor

Yeah, it is, it is.

18:56 Peter

Because you got to get over, don't you like, in terms of the change rooms and obviously on the ground, which goes without saying, but, you know, you kind of, you know, are cricket at the Adelaide Oval for the day, if I can put it that way.

19:07 Trevor

Yeah, absolutely. We... use the indoor nets to warm up and then obviously the change rooms. And we had a cap presentation in the committee room prior... that Philippa Phillips delivered. And... then obviously on the oval itself, it was... a great experience.

19:23 Peter

Yeah. It's brilliant. It's the sort of thing that, you know, it's obviously great when you... get selected to play for your state. But when if I can say those trappings sort of come with it. You know, it kind of makes the experience, you know, very, very memorable and something you would cherish and again, maybe look forward to next year or tell your mates about it, get more people involved.

19:41 Trevor

Yeah, absolutely. You know, we we do a review, after each championships we do a review with the players and... obviously Jason and I look at ourselves as well, another review with SACA as to... how we're all performing and how we can improve and then obviously try and move forward for next year and think about next year. And obviously, if any players are listening to this with an intellectual disability that fancy coming out and having a trial, we'll, you know, if... selected were up for... renewed contracts this year, Jason and I. So if we are selected again, we'll certainly... be doing succession planning if we're not - but also, if we are, then we'll be looking for new players, to try and strengthen the team so we can bring home the trophy.

20:21 Peter

Put me down as referee for yourself. Trevor, I'm happy to play along. What about as far as the best players for South Australia? Is it fair to mention names, single people out?

20:30 Trevor

Oh, it was it was a massive team performance. What we've been pushing throughout the training is the team ethic and, and, you know, Matthias... drove in his first year as captain and really, really stood up and pulled the players together and obviously was a voice for the coach, which was which was really good. So the boys listened and they all pulled together. But, the Goodman twins, as always, bowled exceptionally well. John Lucas bowled well. My son James, he had a strong tournament, a fairly strong tournament. And... Ethan Hooper won player of the tournament. So throughout there was, you know, notable... we had a few debutants as well. We had about five debutants, which was fantastic as well to give them their first tournament and they thoroughly enjoyed it. But no, it was it was really was an overall push... by all four members of the squad.

21:21 Peter

That Ethan won player of the tournament for the whole tournament for all sides.

21:24 Trevor

That's right. Yeah.

21:25 Peter

Oh, tremendous.

21:26 Trevor

Yeah. He... knocked a couple of 50s and batted pretty well... throughout the tournament. So. Yeah, it, played well. But... as I say, they all played well. They all played well in parts.

21:38 Peter

Must be a bit of a helter skelter a few days - because it's all T20, isn't it?

21:41 Trevor

It's T20. Yeah. And they're all morning games, so we're up. We have to get the players up very early and ourselves up very early and... get down to the ground. You know, you've got to have everything... ready to go very early in the morning, nominating your... team. Plus, you know, getting some of those niggles ironed out by the physios. So it's, yeah, it does... it's very tiring week, but it's a very rewarding week.

22:06 Peter

And I guess from a manager's point of view, Trevor, like, you know, 11 can only play. So you kind of got to manage how you handle those that don't play and, you know, kind of you know, put an arm around them if you like, and... sort of encourage them and say, Well, you know, might get a game tomorrow... that sort of... a person... -centred approach is pretty important as well.

22:26 Trevor

Absolutely. That's exactly what we do. You know, we elaborate on... and accentuate that it is a 14 player squad and we try and use all 14 in order to manage niggles down. Lucas, for example, got a hamstring tweak, so we had to rest him in one of the games and get him physio and then, you know, somebody comes in for that. But we did rotate the squad in a couple of games as well, just to freshen things up.

22:54 Peter

What about as far as Australian representation? Anything either happened there after NCIC or coming up in the next little while?

23:01 Trevor

Yeah. The Australian coach, Linda, was there. She would have been taking notes. And, I think there are some letters that have gone out, uasking people to... go to a Cricket Australia camp. But I'm not quite sure which players have been selected at this stage.

23:19 Peter

And what's that aiming at? What's the camp going to be for?

23:22 Trevor

So normally they would... either tour or accept a touring squad from, from the UK or South Africa, I believe. And yeah. So representing your country is obviously the highest level. And getting a baggy green... yeah. You know, that'll come out in due course, I'm sure, but we, you know, we did have some good players and we have got some good players.

23:44 Peter

I won't press any more on that, Trevor. I want you to get the job. So I won't get you in trouble. And that'd count against you. That's fantastic. And just one quick one: the Lord's Taverners, the indoor comp... is that still going? That's been going for a long, long time.

23:56 Trevor

It's been going for a long time. But unfortunately, last year it didn't run - for the first time in many a moon. Unfortunately, there's only sort of... two states... due to cost, I think more than anything. And there's only two states that were, sort of touted to take part, and that was us and Queensland. And then I think Queensland fell away because of duty. And so unfortunately, he doesn't run last year. And so far I'm not sure. I think they're looking at nominations soon for teams, and obviously we'd love to be a part of that. We've got people ready to go that are chomping at the bit, so to speak.

24:34 Peter

I remember Joe tell us about some very thrilling finishes at some of those finals in particular, that I think we had some heartbreakers, some triumphs, didn't we, over the... years?

24:42 Trevor

Yeah, I think we've won it a couple of times now. And we... last time out, we, narrowly lost to Queensland in the grand final - but, no, it's a great, that's another great comp to be a part of. And obviously we see some great players in the Open Men's, the Open Women's that represent Australia and obviously aspire to... you know, play to that standard. So it's you know, the indoor comfort and intellectual disability... is also very high level, and some very good players.

25:10 Peter

And we'll keep our ears, eyes peeled to hear more about that. Trevor, great to catch up. Congratulations. Finishing second. That's a wonderful achievement against the all comers. I'm sure that all the lads will be buttering up for another guy next year, but thanks for spending a bit of time this afternoon.

25:25 Trevor

No problem at all. Peter. Thanks for giving us the opportunity. And, yeah, we'll look to try and bring home the trophy and hopefully have a different conversation next year.

25:33 Peter

You talked you out of people out there that might either have an intellectual disability or know someone that does want to get involved with the cricket. What's the first step? Maybe contact soccer? Or is there like a Facebook page or...?

25:44 Trevor

Yep. They can contact soccer and... if they contact Soccer and advise and ask for Jo Connolly. Oh, yeah. Then, Joe will pull it together and they'll put him in touch with  Jason and I, and the first, first part. And we can take it from there.

26:00 Peter

If anyone can make it happen, Jo can.

26:02 Trevor

Absolutely. She's she's been fabulous for for for Jason and I in terms of... facilitating... practice, making ovals available, making nets available. And so, you know, we... applaud her as well.

26:17 Peter

Go ahead Trev.

26:17 Trevor

All right. Nice speaking with you, Pete.

26:19 Peter

Sir Trevor Smith, the manager of the South Australian team, just back, finishing runners up - a very credible runners up at the National Cricket Inclusion Carnival.

26:29 Song

You're simply the best...

26:31 Andrew

Hi, this is Andrew Edmondson from the Australian Steelers. Thanks for listening to Leisure Link with Peter Greco on Vision Australia Radio network. Anyone? Well, anyone...

26:45 Peter

Let's wrap up the Australian Open, particularly as far as athletes with disabilities go and speak to Pathways and Events Specialist for Tennis Australia, Ben Dew. Ben, always great to catch up.

26:55 Ben

Thanks, Pete. Thanks for having me.

26:56 Peter

Hey, gang. I've been able to catch your breath a bit now.

26:59 Ben

Yeah, mate. Had a bit of time come up for air after what was a massive... few weeks and no doubt few months for the the summer of tennis. So, yeah, it's been good to kind of have some time and spend back with the family and... also reflect on on what was probably the biggest and best Australian Open and summer of tennis in history.

27:21 Peter

What are your reflections, particularly as far as athletes with disabilities went? How do you sort of sum it all up?

27:25 Ben

Yeah, absolutely. It's... it was it was unbelievable in terms of the impact, I think is is the one thing that came back loud and clear, not just from from the players and the, you know, the top players in each of the tournaments that we ran. The impact that had on them. And, you know, the positive impact, but also, the opportunities, you know, some of these were once in a lifetime opportunities to play on the same courts as the professional players... at the Australian Open. But... also the community, you know, a lot of community groups coming in to the Australian Open, and All abilities Day, we saw over, you know, 3000 patrons with disability come through the gates, which is which is awesome. 

So the impact it had on families, you know, parents, obviously seeing their kids having so much fun and coming to an event like the Australian Open is... awesome. And obviously just the patrons as well, just people, you know, coming to enjoy the... best tennis in the world to be able to... access all the whole site, you know, whether it's, you know, calm spaces or, you know, all abilities, access through, you know, different initiatives that we've ran through the Australian Open.

28:33 Peter

That's fantastic. I mean, we hear about the stats, you know, over 100,000, I think turned up overall. But that's a very... telling number. Over 3000 people with disabilities turning up.

28:43 Ben

Yeah. That's right. And I think you know that, uh, All Abilities Day is the second Tuesday of the Australian Open. So we've now had all Abilities Day the last two years and, since before we ran it, the overall attendance on that date... has increased substantially. So, we beat even last year's all abilities, capacity through the gate, this year and you know, and that was all just about engaging lots of different... community groups and, and probably offering more than what we have in the past in terms of access to put a racquet in your hands, you know, whether it's just tennis. But it could have been padel or pickleball or tennis. One of the other formats.

29:23 Peter

Sort of comes under the heading of inclusion, doesn't it?

29:25 Ben

Absolutely. Yeah. And I think tennis is, you know, obviously a sport that looks very much the same across... all our disability pathways. Obviously there's certain certain modifications we make for... things like blind tennis, but... overall it pretty much looks the same. So whether you're a Hot Shots kid, in a mainstream coaching course or whether you've just come, you know, from... a clinic at school or whether you play in the highest level. So it's great to see that people can enjoy a sport that looks fairly much the same. And... the experience is, you know, you can double fault or you can hit lots of unforced errors no matter who you are in the sport. So it's equally as frustrating as... enjoyment.

30:06 Peter

So part of the attraction in a sense. Hey, Ben, what about in terms of international visitors as in players in particular? How did that all pan out?

30:13 Ben

Yeah, it was great. It was the third year that we've run... the Australian Open Dev Championships and the Australian Open Intellectual Disability Championships. So we're really proud that, you know, we're the only Grand Slam in the world actually hosting these eventsfor people with disability at the highest level. So, both tournaments were... stacked with the best in the world. So we had six of the top ten in the world come to Australia. And, we were represented with a few wildcards in... the deaf championships from a couple of local players here in Australia and, and then lots of players from Europe and, the UK. 

So, in the, in the intellectual disability championships we had... Archie Graham from Queensland, he's world number one. UHe went for the treble. So he just won his third men's singles championship in a row, which is amazing. And then Anna McBride, who's from Great Britain. She won her third championship in a row, in the women's singles, which is amazing to see. And then in the deaf championships, we had a guy, Prithvi Sekhar from India. He went back to back in the men's singles. And yeah, from Japan. So Japanese... lady, she also went back to back in the singles. So a couple of returners, which is just a testament obviously to the... level of tournament. 

You know, we're at the pinnacle end. Both tournaments were sanctioned by their disability, you know, global bodies and and had ranking points. So all players were getting... world ranking points there to... assist them getting into further tournaments internationally. And, and obviously we had lots of things like increased prize money and, we had all the matches were streamed, actually live streamed and... viewed on the nine now app, which was great for channel nine to really get on board and, and make sure that, you know, access to viewing these tournaments was the same as any other match. So, uh, that's pretty cool.

32:08 Peter

That's a great follow up by Nine, isn't it? After the great coverage of the Paralympic Games a few months earlier?

32:13 Trevor

Yeah, absolutely.

32:14 Peter

And... you talked about... the Australian Open. I was going to ask you about how it compares to other Grand Slams in terms of the sort of accessibility, the inclusion angle.

32:23 Trevor

Yeah, I was certainly... been leading the way in that area and actually off the back of the last couple of years. Anyway, where we've really made, you know, some, some large improvements, more from... being able to schedule, you know, matches. Obviously you've, you know, like all the major tournaments you've got a constraint on... court availability, you know, in trying to hold them on site as opposed to running the tournament off site and then bringing players on site, which I think might be the first step for some of the other Grand Slams, just purely from a resource point of view and access to courts. 

You know, we certainly have access to more courts than, say, Wimbledon or the French Open? And we also have a willingness to... be able to make it work where we can. So that's the reason why they... run in the last three days of the Australian Open is when the courts become a little bit more available, you know, and having their names in the, on the scoreboards up in lights and, you know. Yeah. Tennis Australia and Australian Open chair umpires and officials and kids, the whole shebang. So, you know, you can compare this to even more than what they would get at the their own world championships. 

So if you look at the Deaf Tennis World Championships or the various Global Games, which is the intellectual disability... World Championships, that they're certainly not getting that level of experience, at all... from there and... yeah, I hopefully I'm working kind of a little bit closer with the LTA, in London to be able to do something similar in future years as well as the French Tennis Federation. They've got an appetite to do probably more in... the deaf tennis space. They've got quite a few players from France in the in the deaf tennis space. So I think I it's likely that they will probably try and introduce a tournament at the French Open later this year, or if not next year. And yeah, I think the USA are pretty keen. 

But... the USTA - again, it's just a massive, the US Open is a massive... event. And you know, you need people that are embedded in DNI to push, you know, push the agenda. And once you kind of get it in, you can kind of capitalise on that and, and see, you know, you can make it work and then tweak things to make it even more enjoyable and benefit beneficial for the players. But for us, we just see the huge opportunity, particularly for our local patrons that come in through the gate. And, you know, you can see what you can be, you know, you can be what you can see, really, if you can't really go there and see someone who has a disability playing at the highest level that you may not dream to be or do that. So for us, the flow on effect is huge just within our national and our state pathways for for tournaments.

35:02 Peter

What about the deaf? We've spoken about blind tennis and also obviously wheelchair tennis. The games are similar, but a little bit different. Would there be any adaptations made for athletes who are deaf when they play tennis?

35:13 Ben

Yeah, there are a couple. Um, obviously we have, um, Auslan and interpreters. So we have international sign... interpreters and Auslan interpreters that are... present. And that just helps with the communication between the players and our tournament staff... whether it's at the tournament desk or whether it's on court with our officials, they have a whiteboard, a little mini whiteboard that the chair umpire will have just in case... they need to write a number or something down because of, you know, obviously the... barrier there. 

But you've got to also remember there's a language barrier as well as as the disability. So last year we actually introduced the scoreboard, which was our first in the world innovation that... had a trigger at the the chair umpire's iPad in the chair. And if it was a let for example, what we see a lot in... high level deaf tennis tournaments is they don't hear the let and so they play on for minutes and minutes. And this rally goes forever. And the... umpire is trying to stop the play. 

And, so the challenge we overcome last year was to put a touch... button on the iPad that triggered the scoreboard to flash cease play. And the scoreboard was at the end of each... end of the court, players could see it and then stop. And then they'd say the umpire saying, you know, second serve or replay. It was a let first serve. So what we then, became savvy to this year is more way more economical. It's just the chair umpire have an extra ball up in the chair. And so if there's a need to stop play, whether it was a close out call, but they just kept playing or if it was a you know, second serve or first serve, the chair umpire would just throw the ball, the spare ball down on the court. And obviously, as soon as tennis players see the ball bouncing on the court, they stop. 

So those kind of things we've been able to, I suppose, finely tuned, but also listening to the players. That's the number one thing, you know, and I think we... sometimes forget, you know, in some instances to include players in the journey and the learning and most of the things I know have come from players and being on court with them or... whatever. So, yeah, it's been really great to see the evolution of that. And in the wheelchair space as well. We had our first junior, Australian Open juniors draw, so, that was exciting to see that Australian Opens now, you know, got an 18 and under boys and girls which was... awesome to see and and also a qualifying for the for the wheelchair men's and women's. 

So there's you know things the growth I suppose internationally is just showing you showing you that it's come a long way. I know it's been in... Grand Slam tennis now. Wheelchair tennis for over ten years. But you're getting to that point where they're going to have qualifying events to get into these top events because of how attractive it is. But the growth of the sport, all over the world.

38:06 Peter

Ben, always great to catch up. I know there's plenty more to come, so we'll we'll keep in touch throughout the year.

38:10 Ben

Sounds good mate. Another big year, as always in tennis. And, oh, never a dull moment. So thanks for... your help in promoting and getting the awareness out there.

38:18 Peter

That's...Ben Dew there, the... very effervescent and enthusiastic Ben Dew, who looks after... events and pathways at Tennis Australia. 

Always great to welcome Pam Mitchell to the program. Our resident councillor. The third week of each month we catch up with Pam. And as I said about... David last fortnight, this is their third decade with us. Pam, welcome and great to have you with us. Happy New Year.

38:48 Pam

Happy New Here is to you. I think we both feel like we've got walking sticks. Really, Peter? But anyway, back to the future. I'm just envisaging you this today, surrounded by beautiful blooms. I can imagine just the around your microphone. You've been inundated with flowers for Valentine's Day.

39:07 Peter

Pam, I love your imagination. I will leave it there. It might be more imagination than fact, but I like it. Hey Pam, you're talking about a very serious topic. Over the last few weeks and months we've had some dreadful incidences bushfires and floods etc..

39:27 Pam

Oh look, it's been it's been terrible. I think that topics of conversations with people when we meet and say hello, it very quickly goes to, Oh my hat, look at, you know, the temperatures, the difference in the weather patterns. The weather seems to have had a whole new vocal opportunity to express itself because it leads to stories about people that have been affected and we all see seem to know someone we've, you know, from the floods that have been in Queensland, which are not out of the woods yet, with that worst in history, the fires in the Grampians and surrounding areas, you know, just... and we know Australians, you know, everybody in the world is affected. 

But we also know Australians also have lost all their possessions, everything being put into their homes. A very lavish homes, I might add, but just investing in their homes through adding and adding and that totally destroyed, totally destroyed. And just people wondering, Will we do that again? Will we, will we rebuild there? Do we, do we move on? Do we go somewhere else? The uprooting of all that, it's just amazing. We also go in, of course, to the war-torn areas we know so much about and have spoken about often over the past years and how that just is so insolvable. Quite frankly, I don't know how you do that. 

Anyway, we have all these things that are happening. It affects... the ecosystem as well. I was reading the other day also where they've stopped kangaroo culling and things, which people will be very happy about that love kangaroos, whatever. But in terms of protecting the environment and the crops and everything else like that, they stopped that because it's just been such a wipeout through these incredible disasters. So it affects us all. And it's not that long ago. You know, these things have triggers. And it's amazing how these experiences, and I'm sure people listening today will be taken back to a prior event when they actually recognise, Wow, I remember when and I'm remembering today in terms of it's not that long ago, it's with just pre COVID when the bushfires in Adelaide Hills and Kangaroo Island just took off.... it was a terrible time. 

And also then over more recent years, in '22 Mannum, the flood right through the town and, so people that have been involved in these, whether you're a first responder, whether you're a relative, whether you've manned a sausage sizzle, whether you've been a victim of these things, you know, they they do trigger us. And we do remember. So the positive of out of that if we look for some because today we're going to talk about having named these things, talking about the road to recovery. You know, a big word around this is more than a word. It's compassion. 

So we can be empathetic, but we can go more with our compassion of remembering some of these times where we've had loved ones or ourselves affected in these times, and just our generosity of spirit and connection in the community, and to keep talking about it with people in terms of finding out just the clues, just a clue coming home from somewhere and thinking, Wow, that discussion has got me thinking. I think that I could offer some pots and pans. I think I could probably take some clothes to Vinnies or to salvos. Knowing that somewhere along the chain the universe will help deliver them to where they're needed. 

I think I can just go in and say, look, I'll just give $10 this week and the bank will know where to send it. Whatever it is, whether it's working on a store, whether it's being on a cooking thing at a, at a school, where at a local oval, whatever. Turning up to help, you know, the firies and saying, Hey, listen, we've made some sandwiches. Can they be delivered in? We don't want to get in the way, but can they be delivered? There are many ways that we can help. 

I know in... and we've spoken about this before... I've done quite a bit in disaster recovery training. I have been privileged to be able to be... in the relief and recovery centres in Mannum and in the Adelaide Hills through these bushfires and floods. And in disaster and in the training I had, which was a global training thing, just knowing that the help we can offer is to help people not be dependent, but to help them realise that as communities, they have this within them, even though today in that ghastliness they may not know how to put one foot in front of the other. They not may not know where the insurance claims coming for from, even if the insurance claim company still exists because of so many claims, they may not know what to do with their property. They may not know if they ever, ever want to live in those areas again. 

But to be able to help people is to help them to... communicate with each other, to keep talking, not to isolate themselves, to know that in disaster recovery, we can go in and we can help these people in these areas, and we can listen to them, and we help them to begin to breathe and talk and walk and associate with each other and to bit by bit, to discover their strength. I know stories are, you know, are beautiful there, just to add to that, but I can remember in Mannum and I sit in the recovery centre and one day this woman came in with a few people behind her, and they had travelled by a tinny from one side of the river to the other to come to get some food. They had no petrol or gas or oil to be able to do, to keep themselves warm or to be able to cook food. 

So they were coming into the centre, and she stood in the doorway with muddy feet from getting out of the tinny and then walking up to be able to come to the centre, and she burst into laughter at the sight of herself standing in this football club, looking down at her feet, looking at the mud over her face, and she just laughed. I have to say that as we stood and we watched her and then moved towards her, the tears then came and just overwhelmed her. But there was a life pod person inside that body, and she needed to be acknowledged and not to be crowded, to be able to share that expression and to know that no one was seeing her as strange or abnormal or over the top, or you should be able to get a grip on it as well as be. 

Know that she was caught in that moment and she was highly respected and regarded and everyone tearing around working out. How can we help this person most? And those that she was concerned about that lived near her? To be able to take as many supplies and support that that they could. Just amazing stories. I know in the I've spoken about this before, and one of our previous talks in the bushfires in the Adelaide Hills, and it being up there, and there was an arts center next door to the recovery center and how this the people there post this fire and post the ash drew their art with ash and resembling that fire and the recovery of little green shoots coming up through that ash, the signs of new life. 

It was just so evocative. I was so incredibly moved and transported with what these people were living with themselves, but they were seeing these new little shoots come up from the ash. Just incredible how people actually recover from these things. We're talking about tourism. We're talking about the ecosystem, the wildlife. We're talking about insurance. We're talking about school fees. We're talking about businesses going to the wall and wondering what they'll ever be like again. And so the more we can attend a sausage sizzle, the more we can feel like whatever our faith is offering, whatever we can in our faith, whether it's prayer or thought or putting a message out into the universe, it's something coming from us that is donated to the poor. 

It doesn't matter what it looks like, it is just our thought and our message that we can actually send. Being able just to feel that compassion and recognize that this year here in these travesties will affect those people next year when they think about somebody else. When I think about them, when I think about the Adelaide Hills, still, when I drive up to Lobethal, the the hairs grow backwards on my arms because I remember. So we are triggered for a long time. But our work, our help to help people recover is to help listen to their stories. To be able to recognise these people will be triggered again themselves, to be able to help them in their strength and listen to them as much as they need to be listened to. That could be us next week. 

So just banding together and helping communities to support themselves and to see their strengths and to hear their stories so they have a journey on. So that's my message for today. Hopefully it can bring a flavour of there is life after. It is not at all to minimise these people, it is to work with them so that they know we have their that back.

49:28 Peter

Green shoots in the ashes. What a lovely picture you paint, Pam. Thank you so much. Now you are a counsellor by profession. 0418 835 767. Welcome back again and we'll catch up again next month.

49:41 Pam

Delighted to be back. 

49:43 Peter

Goodbye Pam. You can contact Pam if you want some one-on-one, 0418 835 767. On the Vision Australia Network through your favorite podcast service on 1197 AM in Adelaide, You're listening to Leisure Link. 

It's always great catching up with Heidi Girolamo from the Liberal Shadow Cabinet. In fact, I just had a new position appointed to her. Heidi, great to catch up. Thanks for your time.

50:15 Heidi

Thank you for having me on.

50:16 Peter

Now recently appointed Shadow Minister of Education.

50:20 Heidi

Ah, yes. Recently appointed Shadow Minister for Education John Gardner, who was the previous... Shadow Education Minister and Education Minister will be retiring at the next election. So I've got the great privilege and honour to be able to take on Shadow Education Minister role, and also to learn from John while he's still in the Parliament here as well. I also still do have cost of living finance and tax reform, so areas that I'm very passionate about as well. But it gives me a broad range of different portfolios to be able to sink my teeth into.

50:54 Peter

I think we've spoken about this before, but kind of the leader, Vincent Tarzia, says, Well, we're having a shadow reshuffle, a cabinet reshuffle. And, you know, I think Heidi is the best person for Education.

51:05 Heidi

Yeah. So that's basically the the Vincent was able to... take a look at the team and be able to rearrange things slightly, but still keep some consistency with a lot of the portfolios, but adding different portfolios to some... members and... like myself who have... having Education, and then others where there were slight tweaks. But I think overall it's a good team and we're very energised in the lead-up to the election to make sure that we've got, we get the policies right within our portfolios and being able to focus on holding Labour to account as well.

51:40 Peter

I remember speaking to John Gardner when he was Shadow Minister for Disability, coincidentally, and and even since then, he strikes me as being a very calm, level headed, clear thinking sort of person. A... no frills and spills, but... just a very safe pair of hands, as I like to say.

51:56 Heidi

That's exactly right. John's been a really key member of our team, obviously Deputy Leader until recently. And education, either as Minister or a Shadow for a long time. So he's a great team member and will be missed, but he's certainly here to help the team still in the background.

52:13 Peter

And, speaking of that Shadow Leader, you're now Deputy Leader in the Legislative Council.

52:18 Heidi

I am, so I was appointed Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Legislative Council recently, which is very exciting. I'm looking forward to working with Nicholas Fanti, who is our leader, and our team, to make sure that we're working hard in the Legislative Council, and I'm able to help help the team with a lot of that.

52:37 Peter

I don't want to get too much off the track, but yeah, often the Liberal Party gets accused of, you know, perhaps being a bit too much of a boys' club. But in the upper house in South Australia, women are very well represented, aren't they? And particularly in leadership roles.

52:50 Heidi

Yeah. Exactly. Right. So we've got a really strong group of women in the upper house. We've got, you know, wonderful women in the lower house. But we can always hoping for more at the election. But certainly in the upper house, we've got an all-female leadership team as well as... you know, key frontbenchers like Michelle Lansing, Laura Henderson, who's coming through as well. So we're very lucky with the team. And we don't do that based on quotas. We do it based on... people putting their hand up and having good support within the party as well. And we've got a really good team that we're working well together and very focused on the on the election and making sure that we're available for the people of South Australia as well, because it is a bit challenging for a lot of South Australians with cost of living and cost of doing business and other challenges as well.

53:43 Peter

Just on that, with the cost of living. I mean, I'm assuming you're formulating policies now to take to the election, which is in, well, just about 13 months time, which isn't too far away. But I guess you've also got to come up with ideas for the government now to implement, because cost of living isn't going away right now. And you know, something in 14 months time might be good, but people want sort of relief now.

54:05 Heidi

No, exactly. So we have made a number of suggestions to the government around cost of living that haven't been taken up, such as the freeze on fees and charges. We think that when things have gone up by inflation, they tend to be going up quite a lot. And I think that would be an easy way for the government to be able to fix that. Also, the GPs, the cost of going to a GP has increased because of the GP payroll tax situation, and many GPs are having to increase that gap by $10-20 a visit, which is a lot. And our policy is to reverse that. And we were hoping the government would do that, but unfortunately that hasn't happened. But that's certainly a key policy for us as well. 

Also, we've announced around... subsidies for batteries as well as a key policy. I think energy is a major issue, and certainly a focus for us at the moment is making sure we've got key energy policies in the lead up to the election, because I think that's a lot of people's biggest bill or biggest increase in bill has been for electricity. And I think we need to see more done in that space.

55:13 Peter

But GP think is really, really interesting Heidi... because it sort of saw us every day that you hear about, you know, is either visits dropping or people not going to the GP or even, you know, getting their scripts because they can't afford it. I mean, the problem with that is, of course, that then people get sicker quicker and worse, and then they end up going to the hospital. And then we have ramping.

55:34 Heidi

Exactly. And I think obviously health is a huge issue still. Ramping certainly hasn't been fixed. And I think there's a lot to be done in that space. And I think a GP is just so important, having that continuity of service so that the GP knows your background and all this, but it the more it costs, the less likely people are to go to their GP and more likely they are to go to the health system, which you know is right, rightly free, but it is buckling because there is more and more people going through the public system rather than being able to address issues early on, like you said. And it tends to be - as a generalisation - a lot of men that may not seek out the help that they need, and then end up getting worse and worse and ending up in the hospital system.

56:22 Peter

Yes, we need more men like me who deal with chickens and go to the doctor at the drop of a hat.

56:26 Heidi

Oh, that's good to hear.

56:28 Peter

Oh my. Almost, almost a self-declared hypochondriac, but that's okay. With your education role, I know you've only been in a short while and you're getting good support from John Gardner. What about that sort of thing? I mean, it probably takes a bit of time to kind of get your head around what's working, what's not working, what could be better kind of to formulate policies going forward?

56:46 Heidi

Yeah, I think within Education, it's an area I've been very passionate about for a long time and really grateful for the opportunity. At the moment, I've been engaging with key stakeholders, meeting with... I met with Catholic Education last week, meeting with different... bodies, getting briefings from the department and just really making sure that I've got my head around everything and being able to make sure that I'm listening and learning as well. I've got my thoughts on what I think needs to change. 

I think one of the issues that gets brought to me by a lot of teachers is the increase in admin within our schools, making it difficult for teachers to be able to focus on teaching. There's obviously been a big focus on bullying, within schools. I think that's a big concern. So there's lots of key issues that I would like to to have a look at. So in Queensland this week that they've announced a review into... cutting back on admin and red tape sort of within education. And I think that that's something that we should be looking at as well. So there's lots to do in this space. And I think people are very passionate. 

And it's just making sure that both the students, the teachers and the parents feel like they're being heard and that there that we've got a world class, we need to have a world class education system here. And I think there's a few gaps at the moment, but there's certainly a way forward to make sure that we have the best education system possible here in South Australia.

58:12 Peter

That admin and red tape, that kind of gets brought up in a lot of different areas of... business employment, doesn't it?

58:19 Heidi

Absolutely. And I think that's made me very much aware of it was in... within business, the red tape element is very challenging, where it can create delays and prevent people to be able to deliver. I think housing is a major issue with when it comes to red tape. And we've got a huge housing shortage. And the feedback I get is that like the time it can take to do a development or to get a housing approvals is still very problematic at a time that we need houses to be built as soon as possible.

58:52 Peter

I'm not sure if you'd have enough time to work through this or indeed how much of it comes under your portfolio. But of course, the current situation has been the rolling out of autism assistance teachers in schools, in primary schools in particular. A, have you got an opinion on that? And B, what do you think sort of sort of going forward with something like that - how do you think that's working?

59:12 Heidi

In theory, the autism inclusion teachers, very important. The only concern I have is that we're making sure that it is that someone is able to be allocated that, and they're not being pulled away from their their daily duties, that they're able to really focus on that or they're not having to do that on top of their current duties. I think that it's an important area to make sure that everyone is able to get a good education and the right support services in place as well. On that one area that I have been asking questions on and will continue is around foundational service support services going into schools, changes in the NDIS. That's an area that I'm very interested in because I do have concerns that I think these sorts of services are really important, but also not putting too much strain on teachers rather than. Yeah, so I think there's a there's a lot to work through in that space as well.

1:00:09 Peter

Because of course, you know, it's all about getting a good start in life. And education is kind of the foundation of that.

1:00:14 Heidi

It's absolutely essential. And I think that that's something that I'll always advocate for. I think that that early support services can be absolutely invaluable to make sure that our children are set up for success in the future.

1:00:27 Peter

And the cost of living in education, particularly people sending their kids to school. That's impactful as well. And you might think, well, you know, people who go to private schools, that's kind of okay for them. But even the public school system can cost their parents quite a lot of money. You know, things like... excursions and that sort of thing.

1:00:45 Heidi

Absolutely. I think it's getting increasingly costly for students. I look at things like iPads that are compulsory or laptops. Those sorts of things are very expensive for many families, uh, whether they be in a public school or at a local Catholic or independent school. I think it's important that all... parents are able to really be able to support their children with their education. It can be challenging, especially if both parents are having to to work and there's not a lot left over that. Obviously, the priority would have to go to education, but there's a lot of sacrifices that are made by parents along the way.

1:01:21 Peter

We've got things like you've got your kids involved with sport, for example, or, you know, artistic endeavours. They also can be very costly if it's out of school.

1:01:29 Heidi

Play sport, music, all those things like you mentioned, camps and even just getting set up for school, you know, we didn't we didn't have devices and things like that when I went through school.

1:01:40 Peter 

I'm not that old, Heidi. Come on. Well, we had a computer room.

1:01:46 Heidi

We've all had our own computers, but now it's a given. I think that all students have to have a lot of those sorts of things. So, I think that that obviously comes with their challenges as well. But it's important that that kids are set up for success when it comes to their education as well.

1:02:03 Peter

And even things as simple and as basic as, you know, good breakfast, good lunches, etc..

1:02:08 Heidi

Exactly. I think... making sure that, yeah, kids have a good start to the day and are able to concentrate during... their lessons. I think that's so important.

1:02:17 Peter

It's staggering the amount of kids that are being provided breakfast for at schools. It's thousands. And you kind of think, Oh, it's sort of a one-off or a little project here and there amongst the few schools, but it's quite widespread. It's quite it's quite alarming in a sense, how widespread it needs to be.

1:02:32 Heidi

Yeah. It is. And I think that's... those sorts of programs are really important. But it is concerning that it seems to be increasing as well. And I think cost of living has a lot to do with that, where parents are really struggling to be able to put literally to put food on the table and are becoming reliant on on programs in schools to be able to provide breakfast and other meals. So it's something I think we should be mindful of and making sure that the government is addressing that as well.

1:03:01 Peter

Heidi, you've gone over time. Or really I've gone over time, but you've helped. So thank you so much for making yourself available. I really appreciate that. I look forward to the next time we catch up.

1:03:10 Heidi

No worries at all. Thanks for your time.

1:03:12 Peter

Heidi there, who's the Shadow Minister for Education? Also Deputy Leader in the Legislative Council in South Australia and a number of other portfolios. 

It's been really great over the last year or more catching up with Jason Bryce from Cash Welcome. Very passionate about keeping cash in the economy. Some recent developments and Jason's on the line to tell us more about it. Jason, always great to catch up.

1:03:37 Jason

How's it going Peter?

1:03:38 Peter

Going especially well now. So the mission's closed yesterday for an important bit of consultation. Can you tell us a bit about this?

1:03:45 Jason

The cash acceptance consultation? The government has proposed a cash mandate that most retailers are selling essential items like fuel, food and medicine must accept cash. The issue is that the proposed mandate will miss out most retailers, and most retailers will therefore get a green light to demand a card or a phone payment from us if they choose. So I'm hoping that the government will. Obviously, a lot of people have made submissions. Thousands I believe... and the government will see the light and realise that the cash mandate has to be a mandate. We... want our legal tenders to be accepted throughout Australia. And we hope that this law will... confirm that right.

1:04:33 Peter

So I believe it's about 97% of... retailers, if you like, or... businesses could kind of opt out of it. Is that right?

1:04:40 Jason

So, yes, the mandate is... supposed to be for essentials. And this is a somewhat contradictory. And I met with the pro the policy team, last week, and they have a list of list of essential items and what is not essential. They've talked about food, fuel and medicine, having retailers selling those things, having to accept cash. The issue is there is an exemption proposed for small businesses with a revenue under $10 million who are not selling essentials. That sounds fine, but that is 97% of all retailers. So the list of essentials is confusing. That's one thing. And any retailer who claims that they're not selling an essential and has a revenue under 10 million can get out of this cash mandate and that. 

Well, I've made a submission saying that's not sustainable. Australians expect to be able to use cash when they go shopping. And, a cash mandate, you would think, should have... well, at least most people, most retailers should be covered. If you've got 97% of retailers not covered, you really can't call it a cash mandate.

1:06:02 Peter

Just the irony of it is, over the last... well, actually, earlier this week here in... Mount Barker, which is a big town out of Adelaide, and also, I think the other day Optus had outages. And of course, if that is the situation when you're going into a shop, they can't accept your card. So if you haven't got cash, they're not going to get your money and you're not going to get your goods.

1:06:21 Jason

Yeah. The outages have been a big factor in, I think, a little bit of a bounce back in the use of cash this year. And last year there seems to have been a bit of a realisation... there was an outage a while back. There was CrowdStrike recently that, you know, having a bit of cash in your pocket is a really good idea for when you're out and about, just in case there's an outage or just in case you want to make a surprise purchase. So I think there's more of that going around, since the end of COVID, the numbers say that cash demand is not in decline anymore. It was pre-COVID, but we've reached a level. There's about 1 million ATM cash transactions. Cash withdrawals every day in...

1:07:07 Peter

A million every day.

1:07:08 Jason

Yeah. 1 million ATM cash withdrawals are made in Australia every day. And that number is unchanged for the last two and a half years. So, yeah, we're not losing our interest in using cash. If anything, there's a bit of a bounce back in the last year or so as people realise they need protection against outages. Reliability is just part of the picture. You know, privacy is really the big thing. If every single transaction we make is online is digitised, then our whole life, basically all our information is out there and all of us have, I think, experienced over the last, you know, in the internet age, we don't know who's got our details. We don't know who's trying to work out how to scam us. We all know somebody who's had thousands of dollars taken out of their account. 

We all know, if it hasn't been ourselves, we all know someone who's lost their personal details to a scammer or a hacker. So these things are really important. The only hedge against that kind of stuff is good old cash. Somebody was telling me today, there's a lot of cash out there in the economy. $100 billion circulating. That's not falling. That's... still increasing. So Australia is a country that loves cash. There's no decline in our demand for cash. There's just a decline in the supply of cash from the banks.

1:08:43 Peter

To get too much off topic. But I note in the last week or two, the National Australia Bank NAB are talking about maybe opening up on a Sunday in some places. I think there's a bit more interest in regional areas, with post offices and banks providing that sort of service as well. So, you know, maybe that the worm is turning.

1:09:01 Jason

It is. And look, the NAB and the other banks have made a commitment to a bank branch closure moratorium. So they're not going to close any more rural and regional bank branches for at least the next year or so. There's a couple of committees having a look at how we manage our banking and cash into the future. I really urge everybody to stay engaged and to pay attention to what's going on, because the decisions that are being made now by government are going to be the rules that we live by, that you know how we pay, how we save, how we manage our money for the next, you know, 30 years or so, because that's how out of date the current laws are. 

So we think cash is legal tender and we think we have a right to use it wherever we like. We don't... hopefully the government's going to bring in this cash mandate that confirms our right to use cash, if we choose, at all retailers throughout Australia, not a fake cash mandate that misses 97% of retailers, because that won't work. Cash only works if it's circulating in the economy, if retailers have got change in their till, if consumers have got notes in their pocket, that's when the cash system works. But too often you can walk into a shop, you want to pay with cash and they don't have enough change. 

So the system works. When there's lots of cash out there and it's generally accepted. That's why the cash mandate can't miss out on 97% of the retailers. That's why all retailers must accept... cash. Unless they've got a really, really good reason.

1:10:48 Peter

Jason, the submissions closed yesterday, as we said. What happens from here, then?

1:10:52 Jason

There'll be a proposal... and of course, there's an election coming up, so we don't, we can't say anything with real certainty. But the plan is - and the policy team from Treasury told me this last week that there will be a cash mandate in force in Australia on the 1st of January, 2026. So that's the end of this year. First day of next year, the deadline, the timeline is the plan that you will have the right to pay with cash if you choose from next year. We don't have it now. We think we have it now. We think legal tender means a right to pay with cash. It doesn't. And hopefully this law will clear it up and it will start on the 1st of January next year.

1:11:36 Peter

Alright, now you've got a website where people can get a lot of good information from and, you know, obviously get in touch with you if they'd like to maybe lobby their own local member of Parliament as well.

1:11:46 Jason

Yes, mate. Welcome.org - look me up. Get involved. There's a petition and, yeah. Write to your local MP because they are considering how to manage cash, into the future. Look, there's no real possibility that we can manage a cashless society in Australia in the foreseeable future. So really, the question is, the banks have got to provide us with banking and cash services in our local communities. So if we choose, we can get cash. It's not like we can just choose like to pay with our card and our phone all the time. Because there are problems, there are outages, there are privacy issues. We need cash for budgeting. So many reasons. 

So we can't let this go. What's happening now is very important for the way we're going to buy, save, manage our money well into the future, how our kids and grandkids are going to do it. So yes, have a conversation. Look up Cash Welcome. Talk to your local MP and get involved. Stay engaged. We definitely don't want to see any more... retraction of banking and cash services in this country.

1:13:03 Peter

Love your passion. Thanks for your time, Jason. We'll speak again soon. 

Jason

Cheers, Peter. 

Peter

Jason Bryce there from Cash and... Cash Welcome, dot org. All that information up with our show notes for you.

1:13:17 Patrick

My name is Patrick Jensen, and I'm a two-time winter Paralympian. You're listening to Leisure Link with Peter Greco on the Vision Australia Radio network.

1:13:28 Peter

Well, I've got some wild, wild life. Oh, Valentine's day has come and gone. But the message of dating, particularly for people with disabilities, is a very, very important one. Important. Let's chat about it with Katie Hammond, who's a peer support worker at Spinal Life Australia. Katie, great to catch up. Thank you for your time.

1:13:46 Katie

Thanks for having me today.

1:13:48 Peter

This is an important thing, I guess as far as your peer support work goes. People talk about dating relationships.

1:13:53 Katie

Absolutely. So being able to... focus on... getting back into relationships and creating relationships is definitely a part of rehabilitation, after... acquiring a disability halfway through your life.

1:14:05 Peter

And I guess often maybe not all the time, but often there are younger people that perhaps might involved in... diving accidents or car accidents that might see them with a... spinal cord injury and... sort of coming to people like you for support.

1:14:21 Katie

Yeah, absolutely. So I'm a peer support officer and I work mainly in the spinal injuries unit, in Brisbane. But, I work with Spinal Life Australia and our... main role is sharing our lived experience and people that we come across after having an injury, a spinal cord injury. There's so many different ways that they've acquired that injury. And I guess, whether it's disease or traumatic, we still want to be able to sit down with these people and discuss, you know, What did your relationship look like? What was your dating history, what kind of things do you want to get back to? And what does love and and connection really mean to you? And how can we move forward with... creating new pictures of what that could look like?

1:15:05 Peter

Sure. And obviously we're all individuals, so some people might be in a relationship and then that can go sour, perhaps after an accident. We've heard about that sort of thing happening. Other people not not might not be in a relationship when whatever happened happens.

1:15:18 Katie

Yeah. You know, and and there are so many places in life that you can be that um, and then, you know, something like this might happen. So whether you have a relationship, you have a dissolving relationship or something like an injury really strengthens the relationship. It doesn't really matter. At the end of the day, it's about focusing on that one person, finding out exactly what it means to them and what they want, and give them the tools to be able to start affecting their own life positively. But, you know, it's about making sure that we understand what their preconceived idea of what a disability is, because sometimes the society really throws a lot of stigmas out there. 

You know, you know, people with disabilities shouldn't be dating because they can't look after themselves or, you know, all these horrific kind of skimming the surface ideas of what, you know, people who live with disabilities deserve. And that's really hard. So we want to make sure that... we have a really good, healthy understanding that, you know, you can move forward and do whatever you want and live to the beat of your own drum. That's okay. We just need to find out who you are and what you love and start, you know, giving you permission to move towards that. Irrelevant of society.

1:16:30 Peter

I'm not sure if today is better or worse than the past. I'm thinking about, obviously online dating and that sort of thing. I think that there's a good thing or a bad thing or no, it's like there's no right or wrong answer.

1:16:41 Katie

No, there isn't - like, you can it can be what you want. So I know for myself, when I was... dating and I thought, you know, I'll try my hand at this whole, you know, dating online business. And so I have a spinal cord injury, and I'm paralysed, and I use a wheelchair. And I thought, You know what? I'll check my my profile picture with me sitting in my wheelchair and just see what types of conversations I have. And then I'll try and see what type of conversations I have when I don't have a picture of me and my wheelchair. And I really found there was a massive difference between those conversations. 

So when I had my my disability visible, I could... get conversations that were literally about my disability. It was like, Tell me about the chair. What's it like? You know, Can you do this? Can you do that? And there's lots of, you know, overarching questions, but it's always about the disability. But when I've got just a picture of my face saying, Hey, this is... what I'm looking for, the conversations are always going to be so much broader. You know, about like, you know, What's my family like? What kind of job do I have? What do I like to do on the weekends? What makes me laugh? What movies have I watched? The conversation is so different.

1:17:52 Peter

And that's kind of, I guess the issue, isn't it?

1:17:54 Katie

It is. So I kind of think, look, if you want to... focus on just being able to practice your conversation skills, definitely just chuck up a, you know, maybe don't mention it for just a second and see what type of conversations you can really start working on. But the ultimate goal is to always be as transparent as you possibly can. I mean, that being said, we are in the dating scene. We're all going to hold back a little bit of crazy and a little bit of quirky for like six months, and then we'll surprise it on them. We're all out here with with bad habits, just trying to trying to be accepted. We can't all be just as perfect as you. 

It's about just trying to work on those communication skills and know that some people are genuinely curious and they don't know how to ask the questions. So if you're able to go, Hey, look, I actually I do have, for example, for myself, I'm paralysed and I can't feel or move my legs. But don't stress, because I do everything myself and really sort of explain a little bit more about what you're able to do and, and be a little bit more open and frank about it.

1:19:09 Peter

I don't know why. I mean, you know, my [?mum's] day at the office is almost a bit like a job interview, isn't it? Like, because often people say, when do you say, I've got a disability, but I can still do this job.

1:19:19 Katie

Yeah, absolutely. And really, you know, that always comes back to the bit where we're like, we're really worried about the the preconceived ideas of somebody making a... decision on our behalf based on what society thinks we can or can't do. And I think that we should be able to... make that decision for ourselves, just like anybody else. Some people have got hidden disabilities, you know, and that's a totally normal part of our society. But, when you have a very visible disability, you're very open to being... judged accidentally by people they don't realise... they think they're doing the right thing, but they actually don't realise that they're making decisions on our behalf. And ... yeah, job... interview or dating, it's the same thing. You just want to get ahead of it.

1:20:05 Peter

And maybe not if you're just looking for, I guess, conventional friendship is that a little bit different and just a sort of extension of that question. I mean, sometimes romance or, you know, meaningful relationships can develop from a friendship, you know, all of a sudden or maybe not all of a sudden, but gradually as people get to know you better, or maybe one person gets to know you better, maybe they fall in fall in love with you.

1:20:27 Katie

Yeah, I'm a huge fan of friends first. I'm a huge fan of friends first because of that... you know, that ability to be able to get to know somebody and giving somebody the space and time and freedom to get to know you past your disability from the get go, rather than having all that pressure on to, you know, land somebody straight away into a romantic relationship, you know, and being friends first is a really good way of being able to, you know, develop those relationships, really, really showcase some of your... flirting styles. 

People who, people who live with especially, like, you know, those physical disabilities... it's hard to flirt because you've lost the ability to, you know, cross your leg and lean in or... to be able to be, you know, touchy and feely and all those kind of things. So... people with disabilities learn to flirt in different ways. Sometimes you've got to be more active with your communication and what you like or don't like or, you know, so being able to practice that kind of stuff can really help develop confidence. So then you can start moving towards, you know, actively dating.

1:21:39 Peter

What about the sort of, the old fashioned ways of meeting, you know, pubs, clubs,  different... venues, etcetera. I mean, even going to and from work, I guess that's probably changed a bit with more people working from home going to and from work, you know, seeing people on the bus train every day, maybe, you know, saying hi and sort of getting to know someone that way.

1:21:57 Katie

Yeah, definitely. Look, I think... it's 2025. I reckon you can do whatever you want, but at the end... but the... difficult thing is that sometimes we do need to be a little bit more bold. And sometimes, you know, to ask somebody on the bus, Hey, I see you here every day, you know, and strike up a conversation, but some people really aren't ready for that. Hey, I see you every day. We should catch up on Friday for a date. How about that? You like it? No. So we always want to make sure there's a little bit of safety involved and... that we're making each other feel safe and comfortable in those moments. 

So, you know, if that's your style, absolutely. Go for it. Definitely. And if you're feeling like that's not your style, then, you know, stick to... what... you know. But you're right. Open your eyes a little bit more. Open the, open your style a little bit more. See who's around. And yeah, just get to know your own environment and who's in it.

1:22:53 Peter

And I guess another thing that you probably do with this rejection of it may be after an accident or an illness or just, you know, if a relationship goes sour. I mean that no-one likes to be rejected. I mean, I guess we're all, you know, we're all in the same, in that boat.

1:23:08 Katie

Absolutely, absolutely. We look, nobody likes rejection. And we have to learn to take that. What do we say with a grain of salt? Um, sometimes there are things that we need to learn about how we behaved in a In a relationship and how we reacted to things. They're life lessons. You know, we're all learning and growing at different rates. And, you know, we're not going to be everyone's cup of tea. We need to make sure that... we know who we are, we know what we're looking for. And we also have to make sure that we are learning and growing and we're confident within ourselves. 

If it doesn't work out, that is that is sad. Give yourself the time to mourn the relationship, but also make sure that you're building yourself back up and knowing that you are worthy of being loved. You are worthy of being respected, and you are worthy of, you know, finding someone that that makes you feel comfortable.

1:24:01 Peter

That's a great note to end on, Katie. If people want to find out more, you've got some information on your website, haven't you?

1:24:05 Katie

Absolutely. We've got so many... resources@spinal.com, or you can reach out to the peer support team for a one-on-one if you'd like.

1:24:13 Peter

Well, can I say this, and I mean this most respectfully, it's okay for you to give advice, but you've got that sparkling personality that would make you attractive to anyone.

1:24:21 Katie

Yeah, but I'm holding back my crazy for six months, so...

1:24:25 Peter

Maybe next fall we'll catch up. Anyway, we'll leave that there. Katie. All the best. Really important message. Thank you for sharing some time with us.

1:24:31 Katie

My absolute pleasure.

1:24:32 S2

Katie Hammond there from [Spinal Life] Australia with some really important information. We'll put those details up with our show notes. 

Normally this week of the month we catch up with our finance guru with finance facts, Neville Horton. Haven't been able to synchronise our clocks and watches as far as Neville goes this month, so hopefully all being well, we'll catch up with Neville next month. But big cheerio to Neville Horton. 

And also a club call tomorrow at the Guv. The third Sunday of each month at the Governor Hindmarsh Hotel there on Port Road, you can turn up between about 10:30 and 11:00 in the morning. There's lunch, dancing, music. There's also fantastic her company and all very inclusive or very, very accessible. So that's kind of cool. Tomorrow the Guv gets underway about 11:00 through till about 2:30. If you want more details, give Andrew Kyprianou a call at 0408 848 649, run by volunteers. Andrew and the team do a wonderful job if you'd like to maybe get involved with that. 0408 848 649. 

A couple of quotes before we go. Actually, not a quite the best taxi driver in the world has said... about time I got back on the radio and had a bit of a say. So Ginger wants to talk about the fact that the Gulf of Mexico will be changed to the Gulf of America. He thinks it should be spelt the Golf - G-O... of America. So, Ginger, as you prepare for a busy Sunday night, thank you for that. So you probably during the week again, maybe with some more pearls of wisdom and a quote that... Henry has sent through from Prospect. Henry, a regular communicator with the program. Henry has got one from Warren Buffett, that wonderful investor who said about gold. He said, gold. We dig it out of the ground just to bury it in vaults. So thank you, Henry, for sending that through. 

Some birthdays before we go. Jason White having a birthday, that rock climber and real estate agent extraordinaire, Rick Nagle, of course, former president of Dignity party. Having a birthday. Champion Norwood footballer in his own time. Happy birthday to you, Rick. Amber Merritt, that wonderful glider. The Australian women's wheelchair basketball team having a birthday. Happy birthday to you, Amber. We wish you all the very best for your particular birthday. 

That's it for the program. Sam, Richard, thanks so much for your help. Pam Green, thanks so much for yours. Reminding you as we like to do that Leisure Link is available on that favorite podcast platform of yours. If you like the show, share the news. We'd like more people to know about it. Now coming up very, very soon... oh, talking about flowers and presents are regaled in this... Valentine's celebration, is Vicki Cousins coming up? Very I don't know, she had time. Oh she might, she'll make time to present Australian Geographic. 

This is Peter Greco saying be kind to yourselves. Be thoughtful and look out for others. All being well, let's link back at the same time next week on Vision Australia Radio. This is Leisure Link.