00:37
S1
On Vision Australiay radio, you're listening to the Seeing Eye Dogs Show with your host {indistinct]. I've got a bit of a three part episode for you. The first is an interview with Jack Lord and Lena Xi, who are Senior Dogs trainers. They've both just completed their PUP trainee diploma. So we're going to be talking a little bit about that journey and how they have found it, the experiences that they've gained and what they're going to be doing in the future with dogs.
Then I'm going to be joined by Catherine Kennedy. From people to people recruitment, talking about the top dog competition, which promotes dogs in workplaces. So for anyone that has a seeing dog, a puppy or working dog, you can enter the competition and potentially win some prizes, as well as spreading the word about seeing dogs in offices and workplaces. So we'd like to get some seeing dog handler and puppy stories as well as just talking a little bit about the promotion of having dogs and workplaces and the benefits that they bring.
Then I'm going to be playing a little snippet of an interview that I did with Peter. Frank and Annie are talking about their life as a kind of seeing dogs, dog and handler team in recognition of the Pet Barn campaign, concluding and the success of that as those two were involved in that campaign.
So without further ado, here is my first interview that I'll be playing today with Jack and Lena, talking about their puppy development trainee diploma. Thank you for listening. Awesome. Thank you, Jack and Lina, for joining me on the show today.
S2
Thanks for having us. Thanks for having us, Harriet.
S1
So we're going to be talking a little bit about, I suppose, your puppy development traineeships, which you've just completed. Congratulations.
S2
Thank you. Thank you.
S1
You both came from different roles. So I might start off if you guys are happy to tell me what your first role at seeing dogs was. Yeah. Don't know who would like to start.
S2
Yeah, I'll start it off. So my first working dogs, I started as a casual kennel attendant, so I think I worked maybe two, three days a week and then that slowly moved into well, quite quickly moved into permanent part time roles and then full time roles, then started working in Puppy Center along with my kennels duties, which was really fun, and then eventually became the senior of the department for about a year and then moved into puppy development and started my traineeship, which is really exciting.
S1
And Lena, what about you?
S3
I start off as a part time puppy center attendant, actually. And I think I was in the puppy centre for about seven years. And after two years, I think I moved into the senior puppy attendant role. And along with that, we did work in kennels as well. So half kennels, half puppy center, and also did a bit of vet nursing on the side as well. So yeah, that was me before I moved here.
S1
So you both had kind of different backgrounds. And Lena, you said that your background before that was, sorry, you've got that vet nursing background. Was that kind of the, I guess, background that you had coming in to seeing our dogs as a puppy centre attendant?
S3
Yeah. So coming in, I was still studying vet nursing, but also doing placements elsewhere at a local vet clinic and did that until I was fully qualified and once was fully qualified. They took me on as a witness to help with all the veterinary things.
S1
Guess if you stay there whilst you're studying. And then he finished studying. It's like, why not just stay on?
S3
Yeah, and it was really helpful because learning all the medical sides of things helps with the medical skills that you need to learn in the puppy centre, especially when you're looking after those well-paying bitches and the little neonates as well. So really handy.
S1
And Jack, what about you? What was your background before seeing dogs?
S2
My background was almost exclusively in dogs, so I'm completely unqualified to do anything outside of the world of dogs. My first job was working at this sort of, I guess, holiday camp for dogs, like a sort of boarding facility. Just as a casual, this is when I was like maybe 16, just working there on the weekends, basically cleaning kennels and running around with the dogs.
I did that for a couple of years and then I moved into a job with the RSPCA. So doing working with the dogs specifically there as well, which was super rewarding and super full on as well. And it taught me a lot and then did that for another couple of years. And then I moved down to Melbourne and that's when I started working here, as a casual.
05:10
S1
So you guys have started this training and now finish it. How long does the traineeship for puppy development roughly last?
S2
So it's about 18 months all up. I suppose you can get it done a bit, a bit quicker. Just depends how quickly you get the assignments and things done. Yeah.
S3
Yeah. So pretty much you have to do lots of case study work along with your caseload. So that's why it also takes that long because you need to kind of see it through as well with the development of your pups.
S1
I suppose even with that kind of prior learning that you've both had at seeing dogs in various spots. Um, yeah, that kind of formal training is definitely required. What type of practical skills did you learn as part of that traineeship?
05:58
S2
We we learn a lot. So we do quite a lot of theory when you're studying it. So a lot of the canine behavioral models and learning theory about how dogs function and work basically to basically apply to the practical skills of some of the really common issues that come up with our puppies. Um, yeah.
S3
Yeah, you definitely... well, for me anyway, I got better at learning reading dog behavior. Yeah. And then implementing, you know, an appropriate training plan for a dog that's struggling with a particular skill and basing on, you know, what behavior you're seeing as well. You need to kind of fine tune that for that specific dog. So I think that's what I learned most.
S2
Yeah, I think my favorite part of it was learning about like, fears and phobias and how to get dogs more comfortable and through those kinds of issues, which I thought was really fascinating. So that was some good practical skills.
S1
And I suppose because a lot of the traineeship you were also managing almost solo or entirely solo a case out of your own dogs, you would have got a quite varied picture of dogs with different strengths and things that you're working on, that type of thing.
S2
Yeah, absolutely. We're managing a full caseload as well as trying to finish off the diploma as well. So. Yeah, it's good because you can obviously do your study and then also apply that immediately to your work. So it just helps you get better really quick.
S1
Probably sticks around a bit longer when you can kind of actually do it as well.
S2
Absolutely.
S3
Yeah, for sure.
S1
That the kind of traineeship and the diploma that you've earned from that, it's not all just kind of fun and games. As you discuss. There are some assignments. What type of study and I guess theory type of things that did you do in the traineeship? Yeah.
S2
So I mean, it's an internationally recognised diploma, which is pretty cool from the ITF. And what it entails is we had obviously a large amount of case studies to do which written up was almost like 4 or 5000 words, maybe a little bit more for each of us. We had an essay to write as well about the movement of the guide dog movement internationally and here in Australia. We had quite a few a number of exams to get through as well around breeding dog learning theory, all kinds of stuff. And we also had some practical examinations, so obedience and handling and those kinds of things.
S1
So in the time that you have been in that traineeship, it's just about kind of two kind of puppy hoods of a dog, really, if it's about 18 months, give or take. Have you watched many of the dogs that you've worked with through puppeteer aren't graduate yet? And how does that feel being part of the end product?
S2
Yeah, it's like because when you when you start probably development, obviously the payoffs can take a while because we're starting with the dogs from such a young age. So we've seen recently quite a few of our dogs go through and work with clients, which is, I mean that's what we're here to do. So it's super fulfilling. It makes me emotional. Yeah, it's the best feeling ever.
S3
Yeah. For me, I think I started getting my own caseload only about just over a year ago, so I'm only seeing the results come through now. And so far I've had two, which is really exciting. My first one was super exciting. He's got a retriever, and, you know, when you, you look at this dog, it's like, he's so bouncy, how can he do this? But then when he started training just shows a whole different side of him that he loved to work. And I don't know, just kind of surprised me as well with his ability. So yeah, I'm finally seeing the results come through now, now that I've got my own caseload. Um, and I've got another one in Sydney at the moment in training. So I know, just got my fingers crossed every time.
10:03
S1
Of course. And I do two for you guys. What were some of the biggest challenges in the role so far?
S2
Think. Think One of the biggest challenges is obviously because we work with such a large number of people. You also work with a large number of like learning styles. So I think one of the biggest challenges is remaining really flexible about how we might teach something to one of our volunteers or even teachers the way we teach something to a dog. It might work really well for one carer or one dog and it might not work at all for someone else. So having to think sort of that sort of lateral thinking, think that's what it's called. We're sort of going to be a bit outside the box, but sort of aim towards that same end goal, but maybe take slightly different avenues to get there.
10:52
S3
Yeah, 100% agree with Jack. Like everyone learns differently. And so that you have to teach it differently as well. And sometimes you might need to teach it slower than usual. Or like I've got carers who do really well. If they record me explaining the whole thing, or I'd have to create like a video for them to watch in their own time. But some will learn really quickly and then just they'll click the moment you show them, but really varies. There's no right or wrong because at the end of the day you get the same results. It's just how you do it.
S1
And it's I guess it's kind of between you guys and your own personal preferences. Then you've got the the puppy and the dog and a variety of different things you need to teach. And then the person on top of that and I guess if your skill, if you're, yeah, your intended method training versus the dog's preferred learning versus the carers as well, it's quite a blend of different kind of competing styles and preferences and, and I guess in some ways the, the dog's choice to do maybe not what you're trying to teach it, that type of thing would be quite interesting. Yeah. It's a factors. So on a bit more of a positive note, what are your kind of favorite parts of element?
S2
I think my favorite part of it is the day to day is really different, which sort of really suits my personality type. Um. Yeah. I mean, you're on the road a lot. You're seeing lots of different people. I love people. I love dogs. So having, you know, five different conversations with five different people in one day is fantastic. And it's all about dog training. I love seeing people develop skills and implementing it to their puppy. That's super rewarding. I love seeing dogs kick goals and overcome issues and things like that. So there's a lot of it that I really, really enjoy. Pretty much the whole thing. Yeah.
S3
Mine would be the same. The flexibility is amazing, you know, you can arrange it in any way you want as long as it works for you. And my relationships with the carer is something I enjoy the most. And you know, you end up learning so much about them and. You end up learning a lot from them as well, from their expertise, wherever they've come from as well. So I often get a lot of advice from my carers when I'm struggling with something that's, you know, not dog related. Sometimes we have a cup of tea or they'll, they'll give you food as well. They'll feed you while in the road. It's amazing. They're amazing. Love them.
S1
So have you got any particular kind of favourite memories or moments or even projects that you've worked on in your time? Um, as a trainee.
S2
I think some of my favorite memories have been... improving and working with some dogs with some really complex challenges. So say, ones that have quite strong fears and phobias around maybe like a staircase or traffic and that kind of stuff. So. Yeah, all of my favorite memories look back on as dogs that have struggled in certain areas and just watch them improve. Has been super rewarding for me.
S3
Yeah, mine will be the same. I had one particular dog who was fearful of stairs for a very long time and we spent a long time working on this and that. One day when she could finally do it, that that was amazing. And that feeling is like, you know, you've reaped your rewards. All the hard work does pay off and you've made a better dog. Though she might not be suitable for the program. It doesn't. It doesn't matter because you've helped her overcome something that could help her cope in the future, even as a pet dog. So that was, yeah, one of my highlights for sure.
15:08
S1
And I guess for that carer too. They would just be so like thrilled that you were able to get them pass up because like you said, even as a pet dog, you know, dog being particularly afraid or worried about something like that that they might have to encounter is. Yeah. Not, not not ideal it's.. yeah.
S3
We're really lucky because these carers are also so on board with everything that you want them to do. So if it's a really strenuous training plan that you've put in place, they're. They're so willing to just do everything to make it work. And the results do show.
S1
So there's a lot of commitment from a lot of different people just to get a puppy from eight weeks. Even up until that point of entering kind of training assessments. It's, yeah, it's quite a village, isn't it?
S3
For sure.
S1
So, Jack, as you're now finishing kind of your time in puppy development and you're moving on to a new traineeship, which is is training dogs to do more guide work. What skills will you take from puppy development to those training dogs?
S2
It's a great question. Think what I'll take across is obviously I've learned a lot of patience working with young puppies, different learning styles as well. Um, and also just coming across, I suppose, more knowledge about that dog learning theory, what works for them, what doesn't work for them, why they do things in a certain way, and also a good perspective, I suppose, on which dogs are good for our clients, what our clients need at the end of the day.
S1
It'll be very interesting to see if you get to train any of the puppies that you've had on your scheme through [indistinct] too.
S2
Yeah, I'm really excited about that. So if I can get one of them through to a client, I'll be super chuffed with that. So yeah, the string I'll be starting on, I'll be having some of three of my puppies, I think so. Really excited about that.
S1
That's super exciting. Well, you guys have a lot of. Yeah, a lot of different work ahead of you in your careers at seeing dogs. So thank you for joining me on the show and talking about basically the start of, um, 1 or 2 different different roles.
S2
Thank you so much for having us, Harriet.
S1
Thanks, guys.
17:34
You've been listening to this on Vision Australia Radio. Hope you enjoyed my interview with Jack and Lena. If you'd like to find out more about the work we do, our hair can help. Or getting involved as a puppy carer working with people like The Amazing Jack and Lena. Why don't you head to our website at Night Vision Australia org.
Now we're going to be playing my interview with Catherine Kennedy talking about the Oz top dog competition. If you're a dog's handler or a dog puppy carer and we'd like to spread the word about dogs in workplaces, we would love to have you enter this competition and get the chance to win some prizes. I hope you enjoyed this interview with Catherine Kennedy. From people to people recruitment and me talking about dogs in office and on top dog competition. Hi Catherine. Thank you for joining me on the show today.
S4
My pleasure. Hello. Nice to see you.
S1
So we're going to talk a little bit about the top dog competition and what it promotes. Could you start off by introducing yourself and then what the competition is?
S4
Yeah, sure. So, yeah, my name is Katherine Kennedy. I'm the managing director for People to People Recruitment. So we're a recruitment firm. We are not a we we don't work with dogs professionally, but we work with lots of different organisations and lots of different employers and Aussies. Top Dog is really a competition that we run every year. It's one of my favourite times of the year actually, and it has been going for three years in Australia. We've been doing it for longer in New Zealand and it really is borne out of some research that we have come across that tells us that dogs in the office have a really positive impact on wellbeing and have a really positive impact on employees mental health.
And so really, this is a kind of light hearted competition, but it's really just to put a spotlight on the positive impact that dogs can have on our lives generally, but that they can have in workplaces and try to let employers see what the benefits for them. Even in terms of the commercial benefits. If you've got happier employees, they're more productive. You can have people want to come into the office more. So that's what it's really all about.
S1
And that makes sense why an employment firm would be interested in in dogs. Really? Yeah, it's a win-win for the dogs coming in and for the employers.
S4
Yeah, indeed.
S1
How can dogs help bring people into the office?
S4
Yeah. So I think a couple of things. I think one, that it is, it just changes the dynamic in the office. People are happier, I think. And I definitely notice in our office days if there's, you know, someone's got their dog there, there's just it just brings a nice sort of energy to the office, which I think makes people more inclined to want to be there. And particularly perhaps for non... people who don't own a dog, but they want to have that opportunity to almost feel like you have almost a surrogate parenting type dynamic and that people feel like, oh well our dogs in today.
So there's that element but also so many people and I don't know the specific statistic you might, but there's been so many people who've become pet owners in the last sort of 3 or 4 years, and we feel guilty if we leave our dogs at home. We don't want to. So, you know, I know for me personally, if I had if my dog was going to be at home five days a week by herself, I would be much I would be wanting to be at home, You know, I'd be more inclined to not want to go into the office because I'd want to be with her. So I think it's an element of people can sort of bring their dog with them and then that that helps them feel a bit less guilty as well.
20:47
S1
So what is the competition in terms of what can people enter and how does it work?
S5
Yeah, okay. So it's really straightforward. There's a the website is simply Oz top dog and it's Aussie top dog.com. Doyou um, so you could find it on any of our if you look up people to people you'll find links to it everywhere. So it's very simple and straightforward to enter. If you go to the website, there's just a couple of steps that you that you go through to nominate your dog.
We actually have three different categories. So there is top office dog, which is fairly self-explanatory, a dog that goes into a workplace. There's top dog with a job. So that's particularly for assistance dogs, for example, or any kind of dog that actually plays some specific role in has a job basically in supporting people, a person or a group of people.
And then there will be an overall People's Choice award, which is so all of the dogs that get entered will be eligible for that. And then there's prizes that that the winners will get. I think the first prize is $1,000. It's not $1,000 in cash. It's a big, big gift basket that is worthy of a beautiful, beautiful pup. And you'll get a lot of coverage that you can promote around around your your network as well.
S1
So you did mention that there is a particular category for working dogs. So, you know, dog guides, senior dogs and puppies are eligible to enter that competition.
S4
Absolutely. Yep. Absolutely. And we've just seen some just such beautiful entries already that have come through. But if I think about the last couple of years as well, where, you know, because the bond that people will have sometimes with the dog, particularly if it's a dog that plays a sort of functional role in their life and their attempt. There's just some... it's just beautiful to just watch the entries and every single one could win really. So yeah, if you have a dog who has a job so as you said are seeing our dog or a therapy dog or any kind of working sort of dog, then they've got their own particular category for those very special, very special ones.
S1
And we do have many dogs that are both dogs who work in an office and with a handler who also works in office. So there you go. You're getting two birds with one stone.
S4
There you go. Exactly.
S1
So just to finish off, why should employers allow dogs in the office? Is there any amazing staff that you have, um, that make that'll really, you know, have someone consider bringing in particular dogs, puppy or working dog into their office?
S4
Yeah, indeed. So I think that I'm just looking for the very specific because I'd like to be able to give you this specific statistic around it.
S1
There's good kind of research into it. It's not just saying, I like dogs. That's that's not...
S4
No, that's right. So it's yeah, I mean, anecdotally, it's definitely the sort of experience that, that I have and that my team has and that we hear amongst employers that there's a really positive impact that, you know, that dogs in the office can have. But research that, that we did showed us that. Let me find you the specific statistic. Sorry, that 3 in 5 employees. So, you know, that's a fairly significant amount, would be much more likely to go into the office if there was a dog. So and more than half said that they would be more than half of employees said they'd be more likely to come into work if they could bring their own dog.
So from an employer perspective, and there's a lot of discussion out there at the moment around people coming back to work and where the balance is with flexibility and a lot of employers and wanting people in the office a lot more. So the research basically says if you tell people they can bring their dog, they'll be more inclined to come, but even their co-workers will be more inclined to be there as well because they just get that, you know, there's all those benefits that come in and then it's around the productivity gains that come from having a happy workforce.
You know, it's if you're purely thinking from a commercial perspective, if you've got a team who wants to be in the office together, they're happy, healthy and engaged, they're going to get good outcomes for you as an employer.
S1
So it's really just common sense for us all to be a bit more open minded about having our furry friends in the workplace.
S5
Yep, indeed, indeed.
S1
Well, thank you so much for joining me on the show. Hopefully we get some lovely seeing dog stories through to the Aussie top dog competition. And yeah, thanks for saying hi and promoting such a such an interesting, yeah, issue of dogs in the workplace.
S4
No, my pleasure, and look if you if anyone who's interested just in following this story if you jump on to us top dog or jump onto our website or any of our social channels, you can see some of the entries that are started to come through or some of them from last year. And it's just if you just want a five minute sort of heartwarming time in your day, it's a nice thing to jump on and do.
S1
So nice bit of scrolling to do it is exactly.
S4
It is.
25:38
S1
You've been listening to this show on business radio. That was my interview with Katherine Kennedy From people to People recruitment, talking about the top dog competition, as well as the benefits of dogs in workplaces. If you have a working dog or puppy, you can bring them in an office and they are absolutely a wonderful member of the staff and tend to do some pretty good things for morale.
Now, without further ado, here is my last interview that I'll be playing, which is a repeat of my interview with Peter Frank, talking about his dog Anna in recognition of the pet barn, seeing dogs appeal for 2023 coming to a close and the success of that campaign. So without further ado, here is my interview with Peter and Anya. Just to start off with, could you please introduce yourself? Do you work? What are your hobbies and interests?
S5
Yeah, I am. I've got a few finger in a few pies. I worked for the Hawthorn Footy Club. We have a Hawks for All Schools program, which is run through our social inclusion and community department. I also have a part time job in Newcastle where I help look after a mate who has primary progressive. I do the occasional day of emergency teaching. I still have my teacher registration, so workwise. That's where I'm at as far as hobbies and interests. I love travelling, music, sport. I'm a sports nut and obviously with a bit of seeing eye dog. I love dogs.
S1
I was going to say before, when you say, you know, you've got your finger in a few pies, I was going to say, Are you allowed to say pies? You know, you're a Hawks athlete. Surely it's got to be like cakes or something different, you know, just to avoid that.
S5
Oh, no, look, the pies are pretty irrelevant to us apart from Sunday's game. But no, I. They are the furthest thing from my mind when I use that word.
S1
Oh, good.
S5
I think food.
S1
Oh, good. I mean, I guess I guess as a as a footy guy you're probably quite aware of like four and 20 and ketchup and all of that stuff. So you did mention that you have a dog. Could you please introduce your seeing eye dog?
S5
Yeah, Anya is my seeing eye dog. I've went into training with the midfield last year. Once things had settled down from from Covid the first time she'll be four years old in September. She's a black lab, and she's. She's absolutely wonderful. There'd be situations that I regularly find myself in that if I didn't have her, I'd really struggle and would be quite daunting. And since I got her, she's made an enormous difference, not only in those situations, but in my confidence in general to navigate my way around and put myself in in situations where I otherwise wouldn't have.
She's adorable, mischievous at times. She's fantastic. And from a companion point of view, you've spent bit every day or every night for sure, and some days that we've had time apart. But when you spend every night for 16 months together, there's there's a really strong bond.
S1
Sounds like with all of the things that you have going on, you probably needed a dog that's got quite a lot of energy and and go if you've got, you know, three jobs and a bunch of hobbies and love that that sport.
S5
So yeah well when when Harry came to do the the initial interview and the assessment and that sort of thing when we were discussing, you know, preferences for dogs, I did initially bring up the idea of a golden retriever. And he was quite adamant that with the lifestyle that that I lead, a retriever may be a little bit timid and I probably needed something a little more assertive. And, um, you certainly is that.
S1
If you've been listening to this talk show on business reality radio, this has been a bit of a bumpy packed episode, so I hope you've enjoyed my interviews with Jack and Lina talking about their traineeship and diploma, the competition with Catherine Kennedy, from people to people recruitment, and my repeat of the interview with Peter, Frank and Anya in recognition of the Pip and Foundation Synod appeal for 2023, which raised $1.35 million, which is about 27 puppies to be trained up to be seeing dogs just like Annie for Pete.
So we would like to thank you all, anyone who made a donation or went to support that appeal because every dollar counts and counts towards an amazing total, which is 27 puppies trained up for Australians who are blind or have low vision. Thank you for listening and don't forget to tune in same time next week for another episode of the radio show.
