00:05 S1 (ID)
This is Studio 1 on Vision Australia Radio.
00:12 S2
Hello, I'm Sam...
00:14 S3
And I'm Lizzie...
00:15 S2
And this is Studio 1, your weekly look at life from a low vision and blind point of view - here on Vision Australia Radio.
00:20 S3
On this week's show, we are going running.
00:24 S2
South Australia is opening its own chapter of Achilles, a group that trains and matches up guide runners to people with a vision impairment who want to go running.
00:32 S3
Yes, and I even give it a go.
00:34 S2
With some mixed results. As we always say at this point, please do get in touch with the show. Whether you have experience of any of the issues covered on this week's episode of Studio 1, or if you think there is something we should be talking about. You never know. Your story and insight may help somebody else who is dealing with something similar.
00:50 S3
You can contact us via email at studio1@visionaustralia.org - that's studio number one at Vision Australia dot org. Or perhaps you could drop us a note on our Facebook. Just go to facebook.com slash VA Radio Network.
01:10 S4
Thank you, everyone, for coming today. This is really exciting for us, because this is something that we've been on our radar for a long time. I have a number of jobs, and some of you may know me in different, different roles, but... blind sports. I work a couple of days a week as a sports development officer. I'm also with some of, you know... South Australian Runners Club, club coach. So therefore this is, you know, just fits in really well there. And I do also work at South Australian Sports Institute as... what we call physical preparation coaches, but in old terminology, strength and conditioning coach.
It's quite exciting because I it was probably 12, 18 months ago, I had reached out to Achilles to see how we could get something happening. Got some ideas and thoughts, but unfortunately then with everything else going on, that fell to the wayside. But then I reached out again when I was ready to get going again, and then just then Castanea jumped on board, which was awesome because now we started. So all of a sudden now we're starting to get that little support network, starting to be created. And it's not just me trying to trying to keep the ball rolling along. So so that kind of brings us here, here where we are now. So I organised the Pacers for the Adelaide Marathon as well.
So I'd love to see us see that expand into being, you know, organizing guides or having people have interests who want to run. And then we can have guides and and for the record, I think the Achilles people are aware of this. It's not just people who are blind or low vision, it's people with other... disabilities. There may also need support to, to get around um, South Australian Sports Institute. I've worked with people with cerebral palsy etc. and there's always challenges in that as well. And the excitement of being able to, to guide somebody, um, and help them achieve their goal is definitely a really a great thing to do.
And... I see it along the same line as those who have ever done pacing in an event. Same thing. The feedback and the thought you get, Oh great, you helped me achieve my goal and all that is really rewarding. But I'm really not the expert because I've got here next to me a couple of guys who have got, what, 30 odd years, 40 years, we don't know. We're going to raise too much money, will we? We will say more than 15 years beside me. So... Sam's actually a Paralympian - represented Australia in Sydney... Sydney and Athens. Was it Seoul? Barcelona, Atlanta? Sydney. There you go. Okay, so. So we've done a few. Yeah.
03:50 S2
Hello, Lizzy. How are we going today?
03:53 S3
It is warm, warm, warm. And I am going pretty good. Thanks. And yourself?
03:58 S2
Um. Well, mixed. I might talk about that just a second later. Now, full disclosure to our listeners yesterday. At the time of recording, it was 40 degrees in Adelaide and instead of curling up underneath the air conditioning, where were we?
04:15 S3
Out at Victoria Park in the centre of Adelaide, taking on a guide running course. And I have to say I nearly passed out. It was pretty gruelling and we didn't run that far. I mean, maybe we ran like 500m in total. But seriously, it was hot.
04:32 S2
Well, as for me, I'm drugged up.
04:35 S3
Drugged up. Oh well, please do explain.
04:37 S2
As you know, I lead a highly active life. I do all sorts of things here and there, and I managed to do my back in.
04:46 S3
How did you do that?
04:48 S2
Well, you might think maybe it was at the gym, or maybe it was out running. No, it was lifting a laundry basket.
04:56 S3
Oh, well, that doesn't surprise me, Sam, because it's something that a lot of people do.
05:00 S2
The thing is, a couple of days earlier, I was shifting around the old style, my old style TVs, and we were getting rid of those. Not a problem. I just bent down the wrong way and all of a sudden I am in agony. So yes, I am on the what? What was we called Mother's Little Helpers at the moment. So yes, it's been an interesting week.
05:27 S3
Okay, so we are here on a nice hot morning at Victoria Park, the former racecourse and what it... until recently the home of the Adelaide 500. Joining me right here now is Dennis Lorenzen, who is a former coach of South Australian blind Sports and a fairly good athlete in your time yourself, weren't you?
05:48 S4
Oh yeah. Yes, I had a few in my youth when I met some, some success... doing athletics. Yeah.
05:56 S3
So what got you into all of this? I mean, you, the first I got to know you was through, blind spots itself. So... what... you know, inspired you to sort of jump over and coach people like myself?
06:10 S4
Well, my son was he was born blind and... so and ended up at the Townsend School for the Blind at Hove. And there they had a wonderful Phys Ed teacher in Jenny Flood. And also must have remember Dennis Peck, who encouraged all her athletes and students to to incorporate athletics as part of their exercise program. So with our son being encouraged to do this, Jenny, uh, was at, uh, quite good in the running aspects of things. And through my, my background, uh, I was familiar with the strength side of things.
So I offered to... assist Jenny, in coaching the kids. So, and then I was thinking, Well, gosh, if I'm coaching your own son, but only coaching others, you really need to qualify. So, and... through both the Australian Track and Field Coaches Association and the Athletics Australia formerly... get my qualifications, which I have. I am an elite coach with the Australian track and field coaches and a level three with the Australian Athletics Australia.
07:20 S3
So what are some of the achievements that your athletes have had?
07:25 S4
Well, yes... predominantly this was in the north east 1990s... got involved in the area about 91, 92... and right through to about 2002... the team in that period and prior, they won the house and a number of times, which was the Australian competition for the state in competing at the Blind Nationals. Through that period, a personal achievement, which I liked, which incorporated all the different aspects of blind sport, the Association of Blind Sporting Clubs. The... what was called the Blind Sporting Council at the time, which was the fundraising body that we set up, we were able to put all we fight.
At least five of South Australians went to the Sydney Olympics in the various. There was a judo with...Tony Clark. Of course, our success with Sonya Penny Bennett, the goalball Christian Stafford in the swimming um and our ring in from Northern Territory and Sam Rickard he was... residing in South Australia at the time, if I recall. Right Sam?
S3
I was, yes.
S4
Yeah. He so he was another one. So we'll claim him as well. And there's someone else. But I just... you caught me on the hop. I can't quite remember. There is another one there somewhere, I'm sure. But... so I take those. Another crowning achievement which which I had a big part in was, um, through through 1996. And one of our nationals, the host state was meant to supply guide runners. And this was in Sydney, and they dutifully did so. However, because of the unfamiliarity with... the guide runners... the people who you train with and so on, these were just people who were athletes themselves and participating and helping out.
There was a couple of incidents where one one of our sprinters missed out by a fraction of a second to qualifying for the for for a world championship. I forget the exact one that he was going for, but it had, he had his own guide runner. He we felt confident that he would have achieved that qualification time. And similarly, another middle distance runner who was so good that he actually needed two guide runners because they ran out of puff. So in the in the change between the two guide runners, he inadvertently stepped onto the guide rail, which is the inside of the track, and twisted an ankle and couldn't complete his his run. So that precipitated... and by the initiative of... three people, all visually impaired, and Tim Haggis, Michael Anderson, fellow who we don't see any more, Paul Crestani... they had this brainwave of forming a body that raised funds that would support blind athletes.
And so they they conjured up this idea. They came forth and and told us the idea, and we said, well, why not? That's a great idea. So we formed a committee which consisted of mostly people who were already on the athletics club board or management. And, um, and we set to it to create a charity for exactly that purpose. So that started in 1996. And now after a couple of name changes, it's called the Blind Sports Foundation and has been going ever since 1996 raising money to support blind sport. So I take great pride in having a strong hand in that in the initial instance.
So, and it's a long winded answer, but I'm proud of my involvement with Blind Sport and and along the way, I've helped when I could. I stopped coaching in about 2002 to pursue other activities and put something back into my industry that I was working, so, which I did. And then I retired from work in 2013 and and always kept touch with the boys... Tim Harris and Michael and the like and Sam bump into each other around the place. So... it's been a wonderful relationship with the blind athletes.
11:39 S3
So what are we doing out here, though, on this... hot day? I mean, what's... the reason why we've... ventured out on a... Sunday morning?
11:49 S4
Yes. Well, this morning, we've been invited to... extol our expertise in guide running, through an association with a running club called the Achilles. This is a single Achilles Australia who are trying to learn to and promoting handicapped people in... into participating in running activities. So they want to learn how to do guide running. And that's what we're going to be doing here today.
12:20 S3
And the beauty of it is we actually have a genuine blind person with us today.
12:23 S5
So I am extremely enthusiast and I wanted to start running for a while, so see what's all about. Oh, wonderful.
12:31 S3
You got that exactly right. And that's what their their goal, their goal of their... club is, I guess, isn't it?
12:39 S5
It's funny you should say that because a friend of mine... Steven Kemp's wife, recently did the New York Marathon, and she reckons there were so many Achilles... athletes out there guiding people and helping people out. So it's great to see that there's such a presence not just in, like, small running events, but also main stage. So the competition.
13:07 S1 (ID)
This is Studio 1 on Vision Australia Radio.
13:20 S3
So we are joined here by Hendrik from Blind Sport SA and I have Justin Crawford.
13:29 S6
Justin Crawford from Achilles series. Adelaide. Yes.
13:31 S53
So... the goal of today really is to teach people how to go and run people like ourselves. What got you involved with this kind of thing?
13:42 S6
It was really a background in running and walking and being active. And I believe that... mental and physical being outside helps with the mental and physical wellbeing. And I saw Achilles in Melbourne a few years ago and went, that's an amazing idea. Bring something here to help more people. And yeah, just sort of started got in touch with Achilles in Sydney, which would have been 26 years went by. How about really?
14:07 S3
Have you had much to do with the blindness and vision care community process?
14:12 S6
No, not really. Funnily enough, I went to a blind school, a kindergarten, and I was first year. And you know how many years ago that is like 35 years ago. And I, other than being involved in charities, I've been a part of an impact 100, which is a charity in SA for a while, and we've had a variety of different people, but not not enough to I've got a lot of learning to do and we've got to work with people like you and hopefully learn some more.
14:35 S3
So you've been involved with Blind Sports SA for a while, but I was there when you were first interviewed. So 14 years ago. So and again, I... had you, prior to being involved with this, had much to do with the disability community in general?
14:53 S6
A little bit. I had in another role I do a strength and conditioning role. I'd worked with a vision impaired, as we now call them. Low vision is the new terminology. So a person with low vision to do the Kokoda Trail. So I helped train her up to build her strength and she achieved it.
15:16 S3
So what gave you the idea to run? Because this is the second one of these seminars. I mean, what gave you the idea to actually start doing this kind of thing?
15:25 S6
Well, it's something that we've been wanting to do for a while. I mean, the challenges are me being a one man band here in Adelaide that... so many things everyone else wants to do. So, as Lizzie would know, I've done stuff at Beyond Blindness, and we've had people wanting to do tandem riding and flying bowls and, and, uh, lesser extent, me being participating, but with blind cricket, etc.. So a number of other sports. And so this is one thing that's been on the radar. And then, then we started it moving along, and I'd had a chat to Achilles in Sydney probably 12, 18 months ago and then unfortunately fell off the radar a little bit.
And then I reached out again. And there just so happened that Justine had also reached out probably within a month or two earlier. And so then I said, fantastic, because all of a sudden the one man band becomes a many, many person band, I should say. And we then we'll be able to get things moving along.
16:22 S3
Okay. So maybe in both, explain what exactly is Achilles?
16:26 S6
So yeah, Achilles started years ago and they actually started just trying to get... people with vision impaired... so low vision people out in the community doing things from walking to running and participating in events. I see. And it was literally someone in America that decided to start that with a friend of his at the time, and it seeks it's just expanded from there. And for me, it's literally about the community inclusion and doing something that I love, like, love and a lot of friends that love running and walking. And for me, you know, other people do what we enjoy, which also that mental aspect.
And on the other side of that, I do some coaching with South Australian Road Runners Club, so I'm part of the organising committee for the Adelaide Marathon, for example. There's a number of other events and I see it as a great opportunity that we can get some people with low vision actually having the opportunity to do half marathons, marathons, um, and we have a support network which, which has been always a challenge having that support network. And so we will now have that in place to to move forward.
17:30 S3
And is this going to be part of a coaching courses or anything like that as well. I mean, has there been any moves as far as that goes?
17:38 S6
Not at this stage, but I'm quite open to to us doing whatever we need to do to keep it moving. And, and if we need to have some kind of official accreditation or whatever from a coaching perspective, let's get it. Let's let's get it involved and let's talk to Athletics SA as well about... getting it included in... their courses as well.
18:00 S3
So let's just get on with this thing then.
18:02 S6
OK. No worries. Thanks, Sam. Thanks, Lizzie.
18:10 S2
You've never really been out and done a proper sort of running session before, have you?
18:15 S3
Not since I was 17. I was a South Australian cross country champion at the time. Can you actually believe that? Probably not, but I was a bit of a runner back in the day. I have not done any running since then. The only running I've actually partaken in is on the treadmill. So to actually get out with a guide runner and go for a proper run was I kind of likened it to trying to learn how to ride a bike as an adult. If you've never ridden a bike before. It was daunting and it was scary.
18:45 S2
And my god, you could actually tell you hadn't been out running for a while as well. The conversation, and I've not included this so much in the recordings that we'll be going to. But was your running like a robot? Why were you running like a robot?
19:04 S3
I don't know. You expect me to have an answer? Okay, so one of the things I said yesterday was that with a seeing eye dog, I'm used to having my hand down straight all the time. Because when you've got the harness, you can't keep your elbow bent at a 90 degree angle. You have to have it down by your side. And obviously that's just what I do with the other arm as well. And so I've never really known how to engage my arms when I've gone walking or running. So I guess I just naturally fell to that sort of stance. And I understand that your arms propel you forward, because once I actually learnt how to do that, I did find that I was able to pick up momentum a lot more quicker.
19:43 S2
And well, it felt a lot more natural as well, didn't it?
19:47 S3
I can't say that I'm not just yet, but I'm sure it will be once I've given it some more goes. I've actually my guide partner and I have actually agreed to train together starting next Monday. We're going out for a run so wish us luck!
20:06 S2
I ran a half marathon this year, but I'm just coming back from having bad knees. I would love to do like, my first goal ever. Yeah, I want to do either one of the five. I like the park. So we're just coming up to see stairs now.
20:20 S3
Up or down? Okay, so this is what.I've been looking forward to seeing how Lizzie runs. Yep. So go for that. See that path there?
20:29 S2
Yes.All right. All right. We're about to get back on the road. I guess not. Oh. There's someone. Yeah. Should we try to jog? We don't have to take a nice slow pace. Here we go, Lizzie. Sweet swing at 'em. Yeah. You're running like a robot. You must stop. There you go. That's better. That's better. Here we go. Nice. Okay, we're turning left, then. Right. I will turn over. And we were. Okay, we got it. We got it again. So Achilles has done its job already.
21:06 S2
And it hasn't even really officially formed. You've actually found found somebody to go out running with?
21:12 S3
Yeah, we swapped numbers. We were texting. And we have these goals that we are training towards, like park runs and maybe a 10-K at the end of the year. But you know, if it happens, it happens. If it doesn't, I'll just be glad to get out and do some running. So our little finding the experience. So is it a friendship what you were expecting or. Um, it's weird. Doing it myself is like... Anything you sort of notice when you have the blindfold on with when you're actually running, but tend to lean?
21:47 S2
Oh, I was... leaning into him. So if you put tension on, a plug, will sound better. Just joking about a dog or a horse, you know, you give a little, suddenly you're. Yeah. Whereas, I mean, I was moving, whereas the guy I was with, I was building on it. He wasn't moving at all. I took to make him move remember always that, you know. So different strokes.
22:11 S3
Did you notice how Camille's slightest divot in the ground all of a sudden becomes like a major fall?
22:15 S2
That's the one thing that does scare me.
22:19 S3
I think I've learned that it is so important to trust the person that you're running with to call out everything, just as it is. With tandem riding, there is a certain amount of communication that goes into any team sport where the athlete is being guided by a sighted individual and just learning about the different forms of communication and what has to go into it to make the run successful and safe again. It's quite daunting. It's quite scary, but I'm really looking forward to getting into it.
22:50 S2
Well, that was a conversation I'd had with one of the other runners because. So Lizzie was the only actually... blind person there, apart from myself and not being me, not being able to run, I wasn't really much of a help as far as that goes. And one of the ladies was saying she was actually rather distracted with a lot of things that was going on around, and she was hearing bugs going past and being very cautious about that. And my comment was, you've got to block those out. That's the problem. The other things in the area, the bugs going past, the other people on the on the track or whatever. That's the problem of the guide runner who is effectively your set of eyes.
23:28 S3
Yes. And again, this is the same with the tandem. You know, when you're on the road and there's cars coming past and you're going between cars and trucks at the lights, you sort of effectively need to just forget that that's happening and just pretend that it's not. And, you know, just try to go with the flow. Because if you start worrying and you start trying to preemptively, you know, guess what the other person's maneuver is going to be or whatever, you're going to create an unsafe situation. So yeah, it's a little bit of like meditation in a way. You sort of just got to zone out, get into your Zen place, you know.
24:01 S2
Now some of the terrain was a little bit rough. How was that when you were going along?
24:05 S3
I love gravel. I actually said this yesterday. I really love walking on gravel. I've done a lot of hikes in the past, and gravel is one of my favorite terrain to run on because you can hear your footsteps on the gravel, you can hear the other person's footsteps on the gravel. If there are bikes coming past you or other people, you can hear them further off. I don't like concrete as much as I like gravel, which is funny enough, but apart from that I didn't mind it so much. It was good. It was really good.
24:33 S2
Believe it or not, concrete is the worst substance to run on. It comes down to resistance. If you are running on a surface like bitumen or concrete, it is actually worse for your legs, whereas gravel or grass is the best... they are the best surfaces to run on because it has a little bit of give to it as well.
24:53 S3
I can totally imagine that. Like the shock absorption, you know, when you pound your feet on concrete, it's this the impact goes straight into your knees and legs, but with the gravel and grass here, I can quite imagine how that would help you.
25:06 S2
So, have we got a convert here? I mean, am I going to see you out at morning training instead of on the bicycle?
25:13 S3
Yeah, I think so. I mean, I'm not going to give up tandem cycling, that's for sure. I thoroughly enjoy it. I however, I am focusing on one specific discipline that being track cycling. So I won't need to dedicate as much time on the road. So I am actually planning on. Yeah, doing a bit more running and getting more engaged with the running community, doing some park runs and maybe some short five k 10-K races if possible. But I'm super keen.
25:41 S2
So as the old man here is opting out, you're opting in.
25:47 S3
So thank you for coming out this morning. And... giving you a time and effort to just probably... a couple of things. I get various queries from people. They'll contact me and say, you know, I want to do a parkrun, I want to do a half marathon, I want to do a marathon or whatever. In the past, it's been really difficult because the chicken before the egg scenario. I find the person, but then I go, well, hang on. I've got no one to to to guide you, so this would be great. We'll now have a bit of a database. And as I've said to some people, even if you get matched up with somebody, don't feel obligated to run with them because Sam, Dennis and I are very aware that there are some people out there with low vision who think the world owes them everything, and you don't need to feel guilty... if you say, look, you've got you've got to be with I think we've talked a lot about this.
You've got to feel comfortable with who you're running, and if you're not feeling comfortable, it's going to be a chore and you're eventually going to say, look, I don't want to. I just don't want to get in my car and drive down to take that person for a run, so that's fine. It would be just reaching back to Justine or myself and just saying, look, this isn't working. And then we're just. And then probably just saying we reached out to me and I'd, I'd, I'd said, Sam around and he'll have a chat to the vision. Okay. We'll get him sorted.
27:06 S2
Well, that's a wrap for this week. A special thank you to Kent, to Dennis and Justine.
27:11 S3
And a big thank you to all of you for listening.
27:14 S2
We'll be back next week on Christmas Day with the first of our holiday specials, where we look at the start of this year.
27:21 S3
But between now and then, please do get in touch with the show. Whether you have experience of any of the issues covered on this week's episode of Studio 1, or if you think there's something we should be talking about. You never know. Your story and insight may help someone who's dealing with something similar.
27:36 S2
You can email us at studio1@visionaustralia.org - that's studio number one at Vision Australia dot org.
27:41 S3
Or perhaps you can search for us on social media, whether that be Facebook or Instagram. Just look for VA Radio Network. We want to hear from you.
27:51 S2
Good bye for now.
27:53 S1
Vision Australia Radio gratefully acknowledges the support of the Community Broadcasting Foundation for Studio 1.
